Vol. 1-Interview-Fedorsha

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Angela Verasano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -1- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

AV: Can you tell me about that?

HF: Oh, they used to say that certain people had such a way of lookin’ at you that you’re “overlooked”. And, if you think you feel chilly, a headache, well, they used to take from a broom handle, the wood from a broom handle, and split it, put it in the stove, and let it burn until it would be charcoal. And then there’d be boiling water, and the charcoal was taken out of the stove and put on top of the stove, and with a knife they would sort of break pieces off and drop it into this water. Well, the strange thing of it is that not every piece sank. Some stayed on top of the water, they didn’t all sink down. So, the saying was that if more pieces sink down than stay up on top of the water, then you are “overlooked”. But if there is more pieces that, ah, if there are…yeah, if there are more pieces that go down to the bottom that you are overlooked, and if there aren’t, then you’re not. So then they used to take this water and give the person a few drinks of that water. And with the back of the hand they would put it across the forehead, put some of that water across the forehead. But, whether there was anything to it or not, I don’t know. Because that’s awfully hard to believe.

AV: Who did that? Anybody you know?

HF: Well, I think among the older people practically everyone believed that. But as the younger ones came along, they just couldn’t see how that would be nor anything. I don’t know how it would – oh, gosht– I looked at people many, many times, I didn’t overlook them, so I just –whether that was just a saying that they had from Europe, whether there was actually anything to it, I don’t know.

AV: Do you know of anyone that tried that?

HF: Oh, I guess there were loads of them that tried it, you know, among the older people when they first came here. I think there were people that tried it. But, as the others began to grow. the next generation, they didn’t do that. And I don’t see anybody being sick that way or anything.

AV: Don’t you think in the power of human hate, or envy, like?

HF: I don’t know. Sometimes there is envy, yes. Sometimes a person doesn’t want to do it, but they envy what you have. If they don’t have what you have, they envy it. But I don’t know.…I do know about some of the remedies that, in the case of cuts or anything like that, that they did–well, I had the experience of knowin’ that they did help. Like I told you yesterday, about warm milk and bread? Well, I know that that does draw. And Mrs. Timko was sayin’ about her neighbor’s boy having’ either a boil or a carbuncle on the back of his head, back of his neck. And she said it was so sore that he couldn’t turn his head or anything. He was even walking to the side because it was so terribly sore. And it wouldn’t come to a head. And if you don’t get that core out of it, it’s going to form all over again. There was a peddler that came around, and some of those peddlers really know some things. I guess they went among so many different people, they heard differnet things. Well, this peddler came around, and he wanted to know what was wrong with the boy. Well, they told him. And he said, Oh, he said, that’s nothing. He said, you take an onion and you crush it, and put that crushed onion on there as a poultice. And he said that will break it through and everything will come out and it will be fine. And she said that worked! I guess anything strong enough to draw will do it.

AV: That’s interesting. What happened that time when some relative of yours had a wasting-away?

HF: Oh, that was my aunt’s children. I think in later years then the doctors used to call that the rickets.

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -2- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

AV: What happened that time?

HF: Well, my aunt took the child to Mr. Walsh (?) [Wahf]. And Mr Walsh [Walck?] used to do it all with prayer, nothing but prayer. And the, the children got better. She had trouble with every one of her children, with the exception of one of her twins. One twin had it, the other one didn’t. And they just will not eat, and they get so cranky. And they can’t sleep. They called that waste-away. But as I say, in later years the doctors called it rickets.

AV: Who was Mr. W

HF: Um-hmm. He used to be a [a pow-wow-er? !!] blacksmith at the colliery, at Hazelbrook. And he used to do that down in his home, but what he did was done with prayer, and nothing else. But he understood a lot of things, because when my dad took my mother down to him, it was during the First World War, and she was having an awful lot of trouble with her stomach. She just didn’t feel good, and she didn’t feel good, and she had pains in her stomach, and she was really getting very thin. So, she was doctorin’, and she wasn’t gettin’ any results. And then Doc Tuppenmeier was called into the service, and my dad said to me, you know, I think I’m going to take her down to see Mr. W he said, because your color is gettin’ bad and you’re gettin’ so thin, something’s wrong. So he took her down to see Mr. W, and after Mr. W looked her over, he said, well I can’t do anything for her, but he said I’ll tell you what, he said, it’s her kidneys. But I don’t remember how many different kind of medicines there are for the kidneys because he said there are so many different things that affect the kidneys, and you see you have to get the right medication for it. So he said you go to your family doctor and you tell your family doctor that it definitely is her kidneys. And then it will be up to him to figure out what medication she needs. So, we had a doctor to take over Doc Tuppenmeier’s place while the doctor was in the service, and he was a very nice person, and my dad talked to him about it, and he tested her urine and he gave her an examination and all. He had to send to Europe for the medicine! They didn’t have it here. And I often heard my dad and mother talk about it, that it took quite a while before that medicine came. And when she started to take that medicine everything cleared up!

AV: What did Mr. W do for that child?

HF: Just pray over it. He didn’t do anything else. You had to go down there at the setting of the sun. When the sun was setting, that’s when he’d take you in.

AV: Every night?

HF: For three nights. Three nights. And all he did was pray. And if you would ask him what he charges, he wouldn’t take. He wouldn’t tell you anything. Nor, he wouldn’t take money. If you wanted to leave any money for him, you had to leave it on the table or somewhere like that. He would never pick it up, that he would charge so much, or so much, for doin’ things for you. If you felt like givin’ him something, all well and good. If you didn’t, all well and good, too. Then, he wanted to train his daughter, because I don’t think he had any sons, and if he did they were dead, and he wanted to train his daughter and she wouldn’t take it up.

AV: Did he ever treat anyone else in the town?

HF: Yeah, our John was treated by him. He got very, very cranky there for a while and he didn’t sleep during the day, he didn’t sleep during the night, and the people had an idea that if you put another child in your child’s cradle, that that child will take away your child’s sleep. Well, nobody was ever put in his cradle. And still and all the kid didn’t sleep. You were up with him day and night. And by doing that, he was failin’. So my

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Angela Verasano interviewing Helen Fedorsha – 1- 7/23/72 Tape 23-3

dad had a lot of faith in Mr. W[????]. And he said to my mother that we should get ready and that we would take the kid and we’re gonna go down and see Mr. W [???] . So they went down to see Mr. W [???] , and after Mr. W [???] looked him over he said, it’s no problem. He said someone took his rest from him. And he said, It’s simple. He was showin’ my dad, but my dad never asked him, he didn’t think of askin’ him–Do you as though you are closin’ a door, or as if you are opening a door?–he didn’t ask him. He used an ordinary house key, and he put it in the kid’s mouth– but this is the thing that my dad didn’t ask, Are you closin’ or are you opening AV(you know, if you close it you turn this way, if you’re opening, you turn the other way), and while you do that, you say In the Name of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost. That’s all to it. He told my dad he said. You can do that any time at all. But my dad never thought of askin’ him whether you do it as though you are opening a door or do you do it as though you are closin’ a door?

AV: You turn it over, once?

 HF: You turn it over once, but I don’t know which way. Because my dad never asked him. Well, the kid was all right after that. And I know there were an awful lot of children that were treated by him, and there were things that he knew that doctors didn’t know it was her kidneys. Mr. W knew right away.

 AV: Do you know of any other instances where he treated people around here?

 HF: There were a lot of people in town that were treated by him. I couldn’t begin to tell you who all was treated by him. My dad was the first told about him by Mr. Barron, George Barron’s father. My brother John had yellow jaundice. He was very sick for fourteen weeks. Any you could see that — because my mother said when they have yellow jaundice, whether it’s a baby or a grown-up person, you’ll get yellow behind the fingernails, your color gets yellow, because it’s your liver that is affected by it. Well, it’s hepatitis, they call it hepatitis now. And he was very cranky. So, they were at their wits’ end already, they didn’t know what to do any more. So Mr. Barron came into our place one day, and my dad started tellin’ him about it. And he said, don’t bother with doctors, they can’t help you with that. And my dad said, What are we supposed to do, wait until the child dies? And he said, Oh no, you don’t have to do that. You go to see Mr. W [???] , over to Hazelton. He was a blacksmith over there. Go see Mr. W [???] , talk to him about it. So my dad went over there, he walked over to Hazelbrook to see Mr. W [???] , and told him about it. And Mr. W said you bring the boy over tomorrow night at the setting of the sun. He went over with him 3 times, and he prayed over him, and that was it!

 AV: Did you ever know what prayers he used?

HF: Hm-um. You hated to pry into his privacy, and although I think if you really would have asked he would have told you. Because, I saw the man once but I can’t can’t place him no-how. I went down there once with my dad, and I don’t know whether it was John that we had down there, I don’t know when it was, because then when he moved from Hazelbrook, he moved to Freeland down on S[??????] (Schwabe) Street. And that’s were he was livin’

 AV: What did the people regard him as? Did they regard him with–what attitude?

HF: With a lot of respect. A lot of respect.

 AV: Did they fear him?

HF: Hm-mm. Hm-mm (No).

 AV: Did they think that it was immoral in some way, in the sense that it was against the laws of……

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -4- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

HF: Not the people that I knew. Not the people that I knew. Never felt that way about it. As far as I know, they had an awful lot of respect for the man.

AV: Where did they think that he go his power?

HF: Well, you don’t get that power from anyone. I think that you get that power from The Man Up Above. And, did you ever hear of them talk about a child bein’ born with what they call a veil?

AV: Yes.

HF: Well, when the children were bein’ born at home, nobody knew about it. They’ll tell you that you shouldn’t tell if the child is born with a veil. But if you tell, then they don’t have any powers. And if you don’t tell, then when they grow up they have powers.

AV: And you don’t even tell the child?

HF: Well, I guess when the child is old enough to know.…And, ah, but how, with children bein’ born in the hospital, you have no idea. If they are, they are destroyed.

AV: What were you supposed to do with a veil?

HF: You were supposed to put it away. You were supposed to keep it.

AV: How?

HF: Well, I never saw them, Angela. I never saw it. I haven’t the slightest idea. All I heard was that it looks like a cap. You know, like a baby’s cap. But I never saw it at all. But Mr. Machella is supposed to have been born with a veil.

AV: Which Machella?

HF: Oh, he is dead now. They were our neighbors. And someone of his family told. And they claim that if you tell, he don’t have any powers. Now, how much truth there is to it, I don’t know.

AV: And did you ever hear of anyone else that had powers?

HF: There were some that claimed, but they could not do what Mr. Wald did. Regardless of how they claimed. There was a man in Freeland by –oh, gee, I don’t know, was it Mr. Acres–his wife used to work in the cigar factory. I don’t know whether his name was Mr. Acres or what it was. Well, some said that he could do the same as Mr. Walt did. But I don’t think he did. Not from what I heard. And…

AV: What did you hear?

HF: And then they would charge for doin’ things. But Mr. Walt didn’t.

AV: What did you hear about this other man?

HF: Well, that he attempted to do those things, but they don’t think he knew how.

AV: Did he do it with prayer, or?

HF: I don’t know, I never saw the man. I never went to him or anything. I never, well, I did see Mr. Walt because I was down with my dad. And I don’t know whether our John was small at that time, did we have him down there, I don’t know, but I know that I was with my dad. But I was so young that I can’t, I can’t remember too well. All I do know was that Mr. Walt had a German accent, that I do know.

AV: You must have been about six or seven?

HF: I don’t know how old I could have been.

AV: And did you ever hear of any other people around here that had some kind of power like that?

HF: No. We didn’t have anyone here in town, nobody.

AV: I heard, too, about the seventh son of a seventh son.

HF: They do say about the seventh son from a seventh son, yes. That they have powers. But that happens very seldom. It’s really unusual to have seven straight

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -5- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

HF: son, and then to have the son have seven sons. Very, very unusual. And today, with all the abortion and everything, you couldn’t have it. And you know, those people don’t stop to think, the ones that favor abortion, don’t stop to think that maybe, not only maybe, but it is very possible that there are a lot of babies bein’ destroyed that, if they were allowed to live, could be a blessing to this world. Some of them maybe, if they were allowed to live, would be very famous men, maybe they would do something very great for humanity. But they put them to death. And then they don’t consider that murder. That is worse murder than anything. And they are going to pay for it. Anyone that has that done is going to pay for it, because that is a horrible crime. When you think of — Angela, you never saw a little baby, you never saw a little baby. Well, all I can tell you is that they are so, so innocent, so helpless, that when you look at them, they just remind you of a little animal that is lookin’ for your love. They are so helpless. They can’t do anything for themselves. If you don’t do it for them, they can’t do it for themselves, and you can’t help lovin’ them. No matter whose child it is, you can’t help lovin’ them. And, and then to think if a woman goes pregnant, she knows that she has conceived, she knows if she lets that child go through the nine months, she knows what she will have. Maybe she will have a beautiful child, maybe she will have someone that in years will be very famous. Maybe someone that will do a world of good for people. And, they have them put to death. I don’t know how they can live with their conscience. Because I don’t care whose child it is. I always said, I never, never saw a funny baby, or an ugly baby.

AV: You like them all?

HF: I think all babies are lovable, and especially after a while when they are able to notice. Because they don’t notice things at the beginning. The only thing they do, their fingers attract them a lot. They’ll put their hands up above themselves, they’ll move those fingers all the while. But after they get a few weeks older, and they are able to notice, and they know when you are talkin’ to them, and they’ll coo away to you, as you’re talkin’ to them, that’s all they can do is coo, coo!

AV: Where did you see them?

HF: Where did I see them? Oh, gracious, I took care of twins, I helped out our Mary’s, when she had her twins.

AV: The twins were Ann’s…

HF: No, my brother Pete’s. And then our Mary had twins. I had to help out because she had a very serious operation then in December — in November — and then her twins were born in May. She wasn’t allowed to walk around too much or anything. And me and our Anna usesd to help out with the twins. When one stopped cryin’, the other one would start cryin’! They didn’t cry at the one time, they didn’t sleep at the one time!

AV: Mrs. Zosak said yesterday that Pete Goodroth had some kind of thing attached to his birth. He was born with a collar?

HF: Not that I know of. I never heard about it.

AV: He was the seventh son?

HF: I never heard about it. That was my brother-in-law. I never heard about it. And he wasn’t a seventh son.

AV: How about the ones born on New Year’s Eve?

HF: I don’t think there was anything special about them, unless, unless they are born with something special. Being born on New Year’s Eve doesn’t mean a thing.

AV: What sorts of powers did they say that these kids born with a collar would have?

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A Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -6- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

HF: Well, they claimed that they were able to see things that would happen that other people don’t see.

AV: Like?

HF: Like Jean Dixon

AV: And the same with the seventh son?

HF: Uh, the seventh son I think has more power in healing. I think that’s what it is, I think it’s more power in healing.

AV: And this Mr. Wact [Walt?] was.…

HF: I don’t know whether he was a seventh son or not. I don’t know.

AV: How did –how did you hear about Mr. Wact?

HF: Well, I heard from my dad and my mother, after Mr. Barron told him about–when he came up and he saw how sick our John was. And they were havin’ a doctor comin’ down, and it wasn’t helpin’. So Mr. Barron looked at him and saw how yellow he was. Mr. Barron said, Oh, that boy is ill, John. He said, The doctor can’t help him. And my dad said, Well, what are we supposed to do? Just wait until he dies? Oh no, he said, you don’t have to do that. Go over to Hazelbrook when you get home from work when you get home from work and go to see Mr. Wald and talk to Mr. Wald about it. So, the next day when my dad came home from work, he got himself ready and went to Hazelbrook and talked to Mr. Wald. He told him to bring him over the next day. Then for three nights they had to take him over at the setting of the sun.

AV: Did you go on all three?

HF: Oh, I, I probably wasn’t even around. I probably wasn’t. Because our John was just a baby, and he was the first child, and I was the fifth.

AV: And so you never had a chance to consult him for a person or yourself?

HF: Ahh, I did see Mr. Wald personally, but I wasn’t old enough to get into a conversation with him. I just went there with my dad, and I don’t know what baby it was that they had down there at the time. I don’t know. But all the conversation went on between him and my dad. Because, you know a lot of people felt this way, that the, the children should be seen but not heard. So, you had to have a lot of respect for an older person. You couldn’t just butt into their conversation.

AV: Did you know how much he contributed to Mr. Wald?

HF: I don’t know how much my dad gave him.

AV: Did you ever consult anybody like that for something of yourself?

HF: Hm-mmm, Hm-mmm, Because Mr. Wald wasn’t around any more, and, ah, the ones that claimed that they had that power, they didn’t have that power.

AV: You heard that they didn’t?

HF: Well, the pople that went to them didn’t get any results, so you knew darn well they didn’t have the power. And as long as they were chargin’ a certain amount–and none of those people that have that power will charge. If you want to give them a donation, all well and good, and if not, all well and good.

AV: Do you think that affects their power? If they charge or not?

HF: I don’t know. I don’t know whether it does or not, or do they just do it out of the goodness of their heart? Mind, in those days there were an awful lot of very good people. Good living people. God-fearing people, and regardless of whether they were Protestant, or whether they were Catholic, many times you would find some of the Protestants that, ah, were more God-fearing than the Catholics. And of course you had a lot of respect for them, because, well, I don’t know, I just had an idea that everyone got along, nobody – the only time when the Irish used to abuse our class of people so much — but they helped one another out, that is one thing you don’t see today.

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -7- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

AV: Why do you think they were so helpful before?

HF: I don’t know what it is. Did the people of this world change, or–I feel that when they get a little bit higher up in the world, have a little bit more than the next person, then I think they sort of ignore you. But I mean, everybody was on the one level. Everybody was poor. They helped one another.

AV: And this included sharing of these kinds of talents?

HF: Well, you couldn’t give those talents away, by no means, but you could help people. That was more than anything, as long as you could help a person, that meant an awful lot.

AV: Did you hear of anybody being helped by the people “with a collar”, that could see into the future?

HF: Well, I don’t know of anyone that could see into the future. Not in my time, I don’t remember anyone.

AV: Did they use any–Around here, did they use any good luck charms, to keep away, like to keep away the Devil or something like that?

HF: I think the best, the best good luck charm to keep the Devil away is to not sin! I think that’s the best good luck charm! Ha! Ha!

AV: I know sometimes in Italy they carry a little medal…

HF: Well, there’s, ah, I know that in cars we carried the medal of Saint Christopher. But in later years then, even priests made a joke about it. “The way some of them drive, that Saint Christopher wants to see if he can jump out!” And, if you’re not gonna be careful, Saint Christopher or anyone else isn’t gonna protect you, you’re gonna be reckless! We do wear medals, you’d have the medal of the Blessed Mother, or the Sacred Heart.

AV: What’s that supposed to protect from, according to tradition?

HF: Well, I wouldn’t say it protected you from anything. It was just, as far as I’m concerned–I don’t know how anyone else felt about it–as far as I was concerned, it was just showing respect for that, either the Blessed Mother or the Sacred Heart. And, yeah, they gave medals, because I got one from Bishop Elko’s brother. And I should think it’s the Child Jesus on that medal. When Paramount was here, it was the thirtieth of May, and we were up at Freeland at the cemetery. And then I come down at our Anna’s, and it looked like it was gonna rain–oh, the clouds were gettin’ heavy. And, not right then, because there was a parade, there was always a parade up there on the thirtieth of May–you know, the school band and the fire trucks and one year they had the boys’ band from down at Whitehaven State School, you know they’re all retarded children, and they played marvelously well for retarded children, and as they were passin’, everyone cheered them on because, well, they actually were good when you consider what their condition was–and, so we watched the parade, and we just about, I think that everyone just about got back to their home base when it started to rain. So I stayed at our Anna’s until the rain passed, and then I went up to the cemetery to take, I had a big pot of lavender chrysanthemums up on a grave. And I knew that if I don’t take it, the priest would take it. And I wasn’t gonna let him have it. I paid for it, and it was mine, I wasn’t gonna let him have it. If it–like, other priests, we could keep a pot of flowers on the lot as long as we took care of it, you know, that you didn’t let it die out and lay there like that, all dead, you could keep it on there for as long as you wanted to–but not with him. He would tell you you could keep it there for a few days, but that very same evening, he would go around with a wheelbarrow and start pickin’ up all the flowers off the graves. So, I went up to get my chrysanthemum from there, and I just about got home, and I didn’t even put the car in the

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -8- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

[the word “Story” is written in the left margin]

HF: garage, and it started to pour down rain. Well, I hurried down to the house, because the windows upstairs were open, and I knew I’d get rain in, so I hurried down, and I quick ran upstairs and put the windows down, and then I walked into the parlor, and I could hear someone talkin’ on my front porch. And it started lightening-thunder, and I was gonna open the door, and ask the people in, whoever they were, and I thought, I think I should mind my own business. So I started to walk away from the front door, there, and I was part-way into the middle room, and I thought, if I was out there and it was thunderin’-lightning, I’d like to have someone ask me into the house. Very small of me to do this. So I turned back to the door, and I opened the door again, and I said, Do you people care to come in, until after the storm? And there was one man and two ladies. And see, the way the rain was comin’, they were gettin’ wet on the porch anyhouw. So this lad said, Oh, he said, we’ll be just too happy to go in. And their car–see, the street was blocked off, you couldn’t drive cars on the street–their car was way down below Ellis’s. So they came in, and as soon as they sat down, the one lady said to me, Are you Greek Catholic? And I said, Yes, why do you ask? And she said, Well, I see the pictures on the wall, and, she said, almost every Greek Catholic family has that picture. And I said to her [large blank space with handwritten question mark] That gives you the creeps! So, she gave me an introduction to these two people. She said, that is Bishop Elko’s brother, and that is Bishop Elko’s sister. And I’m–oh, what was her name–from McAdoo. But then, they moved from McAdoo, they were livin’ in Hazleton. And I said, Bishop Elko’s brother and sister! And she said, yes! And I said, well, I never thought that I would meet anybody that is related to the Bishop. And I said and By the way, how is the Bishop doin’, and his brother said, Well, he’s cleared of all charges, but he still can’t get back to the United States. And I told them then what I did. I said, you know, I went to the door, and I was gonna ask whoever was out there if they would come in. But then I thought I should mind my own business. I said, After I walked partway in, I turned back again and I opened the door, because I thought if I was standin’ out there, I’d like to be asked in. So I said, it must have just been an act of God that I did it. I said, Because I am really thrilled to meet someone who is related to the Bishop, because I always thought well of him, and I still do. Well, then, he put his hand in his pocket, and he took out a medal, and he said to me, the Bishop gave me quite a few of these medals, and he said that if I meet up with someone that I think is worthy of havin’ a medal, I should give it to them. So I’m giving you this medal. And I thanked him for it, and I said, Well, I’ll be thrilled with it. So, I never, I never felt that they were going to, that a medal would guard you from anything, I just felt it was a symbol of your faith, or, if there’s a lot of people who have a great devotion to Saint Anthony, there’s a lot of people who have a great devotion to Saint Francis, there are different ones. Now I know some that have, they trust Saint Jude, and they have all the faith in the world in Saint Jude. He is supposed to be the saint for impossible cases, you know, cases that you don’t think will ever get well, or anything, that if you pray to him, that he will help you out. Well, the, Our Lady of Perpetual Help. I found that any time that, if anyone was sick, I was asked to pray for them, I would say–it is said on a pair of Rosary beads. And it can be said in our way, or it can be said in English. And it’s just on the one rosary bead, you–I have the translation for the English–it’s a little holy picture with Our Lady of Perpetual Help on it–I got it from the Sisters of Saint Basil, Anyway it’s

Our lady of Perpetual Help, Hear our plea.

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha 7/23/72 Tape 23-2 424

And then, on the ten beads, all you say is Oh, Mary save us Oh, Mary save us on the ten beads, you…

AV: In Slovonic, what is it?

HF: In Slovonic, it’s on the one, I have my rosary here, and I’ll show you… …on this bead, you would say–I’ll say it in our way, but while you’re still here, I’ll look for the English version– [there are several lines left blank with the word “Slovonic” handwritten in the space] on the ten, you say that same thing, Mary, help us, Mary, help us.

 AV: On which of the ten beads?

 HF: On each of the ten beads, you say, Oh, Mary help us. Then, on this one, the Our Father bead, you say [there are several lines left blank with the word “Slovonic” handwritten in the space] Then you again say, Oh, Mary help us, on all these ten beads. You do that throughout. Then, when you get back here, on this bead you’ll again say [there are several lines left blank with the word “Slovonic” handwritten in the space] Then you say the Hail Mary. And, in our way it’s [there are several lines left blank with the word “Slovonic” handwritten in the space]

page_0010

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha 7/23/72 Tape 23-2 –10– 454

On the next two you say the same thing, and on this last one, then you say, Under your Patronage: [there are several lines left blank with the word “Slovonic” handwritten in the space]

 AV: What do you mean, Under your Patronage?

HF: That is a prayer to Our Blessed Mother, that you put yourself under her patronage, and she should pray before her son, Jesus Christ, for all of your petitions. We say that, well, I should think we all do, I don’t know whether we do or not, but I know I do, I was taught that way when I was a kid, in all of our morning prayers, our evening prayers, we pray that.

 AV: What do you say on the Cross, when you start out, anything?

HF: Yes, we kiss it and make the sign of the Cross, that’s all.

 AV: What would you say was the importance of the rosary to the older people?

HF: Well, I think the rosary is important to all, old and young, because you can, if you are troubled, and if you pick up the rosary, and the house is quiet, you pick up the rosary and say the rosary, it can calm you down beautifully. Or, if anybody is very sick, and you are at your wits end and you don’t know what to do, you pray the rosary and that helps. I find it a great consola tion, and I find it very, oh, how should I express it? It calms you down, it makes you forget all the troubles that are goin’ on. It really does something for you. I think I would be lost without a rosary. Even, now, old man Swisko–he was married to our John’s grandmother–he could not pray on beads. He used to get mixed up, but he had a shoelace, and he had knots made on the black shoelace, and he’d pray the rosary on those knots. And give him a pair of beads, he ussed to get mixed up on them.

 AV: Do you still find it helpful, when you are not upset over anything?

HF: Yes, I find it is my duty to say the rosary every day. And when I was re tiring from work, in one way I was happy that I would have a chance to say my rosary every day. When I was workin’ I couldn’t always do it. Because many times when I’d get home from work, there are things to be done. Well, all the while my mother was laid up, there was too much work to be done. Father Shuva [? the word that looks like Shuva is handwritten on this typewritten page] told me, he said, don’t worry about your prayers. You’re takin’ care of your mother, that’s prayers. So don’t worry about it. And he said all you want to do is say the Our Father and the Hail Mary and he said, let the rest of it go. But then, after they were gone, there still was work to be done at home that I had to do all by myself, and many times it would be so late that, if I started to say the rosary I would fall alseep on it. So when I was retiring, in one way I was happy that I could say the rosary every day, to make up for what I didn’t do when I was working.

page_0011

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -11- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

AV: Did you ever hear what they said, that if you fall asleep while saying the rosary, what happened, ah.…

HF: Father Theodore told me one time–I used to, while my mother was still livin’, I used to fall asleep over my prayers many times, oh many times. I’d wake, and I didn’t know where I left off. So, I was makin’ my confession there once, and I said to Father Theodore, Father, I fell asleep on my prayers a number of nights, I was so tired, and I fell asleep. And he said, but you were sayin’ your prayers, you didn’t pass up your prayers. And I told him I didn’t pass up my prayers, but I was too tired and I fell asleep in the middle of them. Well, look at it this way. Supposin’ you would die in your sleep. The last thing you did in this world was talk to God, because that’s what prayer is. He said, prayer is nothing else but talk to God. So he said you would have that consolation of knowing that the last thing you did in this world was talk to God.

AV: Did you ever hear that, if you fall asleep saying the rosary, a guardian angel finishes it for you?

HF: I never heard it, no. Father Theodore just told me that you’re talkin’ to God, and that’s the last thing you did in this world.

AV: And why do you feel it’s your duty to say it every day?

HF: Well, I think is is my duty to say it every day, because the rosary helps. And Our Lady of Fatima said that people should say the rosary because that’s the only way the world will be saved, to say the Rosary. She also advocated hearing mass on the first Saturday of the month. For a while the priests kept that up. And, all of a sudden they dropped it.

AV: What about the older people, how did they use the rosary?

HF: The same way.

AV: Were they all devoted to it?

HF: Yes–my dad never was, because my dad was never taught to say it. And we had a missionary father here in Freeland one year–we were still living’ up on the Back Street–and he stressed the rosary an awful lot, he was a Redemptrist father. And he stressed the rosary a lot. A family rosary. That the entire family should say the rosary every night. So I came home from mission one night, and I told my mother and dad about it. And I said you know, we should do that now, I said, because it’s only three of us that are left at home, we’ll find time enough to say the rosary each night. And my dad said, I don’t know anything at all about the rosary. And I got him a pair of rosary beads–I asked Mary Cardishko, she was goin’ to Hazleton, she should get him a pair of rosaries in the Catholic Guild. She did get him a pair of Irish horn rosaries, but it was a small bead. They’re very durable, but it was a small bead. He couldn’t feel them when he had them in his fingers, because his fingers were old already and I guess they were numb, and he couldn’t feel them, so he wanted a larger bead. Well then I got him a larger bead from the Bertha Shop. And we started to say the rosary, and I showed him on what bead what is said. And after the first few times that we did that–we used to say it right after supper–the first few times that we did that, my dad said, just think, I am such an old man, and I never knew how to say the rosary, and there’s nothing to it! And I told him, you don’t have to say the mysteries, I said, because if you belong to a rosary society then naturally you have to know the mysteries, but otherwise, I said, as long as you say the Our Father and the Hail Marys, and the Apostles’ Creed–oh you said about, when you are starting the rosary, you say the Apostles’ Creed on the Cross–and I said, as long as you say those prayers, I said, you don’t have to mention mysteries. And he said To think that I got to be such an old man, and there is nothing to it! Well,

page_0012

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -12- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

[566 handwritten in margin]

HF: Angela, you’d be surprised how much time he spent with his rosary in later years. My mother was bedfast, and I’d be at work, and she was sleeping, he would sit here at the table and he would say the rosary. And if she called for something, he would spread the rosary out on the table, and whereever he was at, he would put a match there. Then when he came back to it, he would know where he was at. Even that evening when he died, when, after he had a bite to eat and went to bed, then after a little while he said to me, I didn’t say my rosary today–I didn’t say my beads today. And I said, Oh, the evening is long, I said. You have plenty of time to say your beads. But, things happen fast. He never said them that night, because by quarter to eleven he was dead.

AV: Did you think that made any difference?

HF: No, no. God isn’t that kind of person. God knows our weaknesses, he knows our sicknesses, he knows our intentions, better than anybody else does. And he allows us for a lot of things that we don’t think he does, but he does.

AV: Did lots of the men say the beads around here?

HF: Not in the beginning, but as time went on, yes, a lot of the men said the beads.

AV: Why not in the beginning?

HF: I don’t know, I guess they were, they didn’t hear so much about it in, in the church. Now, in our church, at one time they didn’t stress the rosary. But in later years they did. It was this priest that they didn’t want you to say the rosary in church, you should…

AV: Father O’Salis?

HF: …sing the liturgy. But when he had that, when my brother Pete was bein’ buried, and he was yellin’ about the rosary, and at a funeral there are all kinds of people, he should have had a little more respect. But he started out about, Not to say the rosary! Not to say the rosary!

AV: And that was an important part of the people’s customs…

HF: Certainly! Certainly!

AV: But, these men, how did they learn, who taught them after a while, that they learned the rosary?

[600 written in margin]

HF: Well, I think, you know, they were in school, like that, one person taught another. Now, when my brother John was growin’ up, there were no catechism classes, that you could have gone to catechism class and study. There was a man livin’ here in town–not that I remember him, because it was before my time, but I heard my mother and dad talk about him–and he was very interested in teaching the younger children their prayers. And he talked to old Father Mardiak, and he was, he was one little Saint if there ever was one…

AV: What was his name?

HF: Father Mardiak.

AV: Oh.

HF: And I’m always happy that he baptized me, to have such a good person baptize me.

AV: Who taught your mother to say the rosary?

HF: She was taught by her aunt in Europe.

AV: Who taught you?

HF: I taught myself.

AV: Where did you hear it?

HF: I could hear them praying it in church.

AV: The women?

HF: Yes. The Rosary Society. And then this man undertook, with Father Mardiak’s help, he sort of gave him encouragement.

AV: Which man was this?

HF: A man here at Eckley that started to teach the children their prayers and

page_0013

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -13- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

[619 in margin]

HF: the Catechism.

AV: What was his name, do you know?

HF: Mister, um, um, I don’t remember, but I heard the name a million times, and my dad said that he had a long table in the kitchen, and benches, and the children were sittin’ on these benches, and he was walkin’ around with a little stick in his hand, and he was teachin’ them. And he was the one that taught the Confession prayer. You know, at one time we just didn’t go to Confession and say, Bless me, Father, I have sinned. It was a prayer that you prayed before you said your sins.

AV: What was that prayer?

HF: [Slavonic]

No, this was the prayer that I was sayin’. It wasn’t Confession.…(she pauses to think)…Well, I’ll be a monkey! I didn’t say it for so long.…

AV: Well, it’ll come back.

HF: Yes, I have a prayer book! I can see it.

AV: But, who taught that prayer?

HF: This man taught the children. Then Father Mardiak used to come down, and then he was teachin’ them Catechism, and was teachin’ them prayers.

AV: From a book, or did you learn it by ear?

HF: Well, I learned mine from a cantor. But this man was teachin’ them–he didn’t know how to read, and he was teachin’ the children. Because when my dad took our John in there, as a student, he watched what this man was doin’. And Father Mardiak used to come down about once a month to examine the children, ask them questions, see how well they knew it. So this man said to my daddy, I’m teachin’ them, at the same time I’m learnin’ myself. And–Oh, I remember the Communion Prayer!

AV: What is it?

HF: [Slavonic]

AV: Which is–roughly , what does it say?

HF: I, a sinner, am confessing to our Lord God of mine, To the Blessed Mother, to all the Saints, That I have sinned. And to you, Father, and then you say your sins

And then, after he would give you absolution and give you a penance, then he would say your act of contrition. And your act of contrition was:

page_0014

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -14- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

[670 in margin]

HF: You are sorry for your sins, you are sorry you offended God, not so much because you lost Heaven, but because you offended the Goodness of God. That’s why you’re sorry. And you’re askin’ forgiveness for it, and you’re promising to better your life, and you’re also asking your Confessor to give you a penance. And you’re sorry, you tell the Blessed Mother you are sorry for what you have done, and you are gonna better your life. So, I’ll give you one little example of what happened. I–naturally, around here, what kind of great sin are you going to commit? Especially in years gone by? There weren’t those occasions to sin, as there are now. And even if there are now, not many people from a town like this get out that they are able to see all that sin or commit all that sin. So, the sins that you usually felt that you commited was, maybe you talked about some of your neighbors, and maybe you were disrespectful to your parents, maybe you told a few lies, maybe you were angry–that was all considered sin. Well, it just seemed that every time I went to Confession, I had the same thing to tell. Of course, I couldn’t expect the priest to remember that, because he had so many to hear that he couldn’t possibly remember! But, as I said, a number of times I never, never got a scoldin’ from Father Shuba [?} at Confession. He was a marvelous person to make a confession to. If he thoughst you needed help, he would help you out. Or, if he thought that maybe you forgot something, he would remind you. And this time, he said to me, Did you better your life since the last confession? Well, I had to admit that I didn’t! Because, if I would say yes, I would be lyin’. So I said to him, No, Father, I didn’t. And he said, And who did you make a promise to in your last Confession? You didn’t promise me, you promised God, didn’t you? And he said, If you promise a friend something, you are going to go out of your way to keep your promise. You promised God, and you forgot your promise. That’s not very nice, not very nice. Well, I’ll tell you, Angela, that I felt like two cents! I did not get a scolding, but that was better than a scoldin’, that was better than a sermon! Yes, I can remember that so well, and I can always say that I never, never got a scoldin’ from Father Shuba, never.

AV: He was really hard! Did he give a penance, then?

HF: Oh, yes, you’d get a penance.

AV: What sorts of things did they give for penances around here?

HF: Well, they, you usually get about five Our Fathers, five Hail Marys, and some of the priests will tell you what purpose they are to be prayed for–either for peace of the world, or if it’s the month of June, that’s the month of the Sacred Heart, that’ll be in honor of the Sacred Heart. In the month of July is the Precious Blood. They have their different intentions, and they’ll tell you.

AV: That’s all they used to give around here, such light penances like that?

HF: Well, I don’t know what they’d give for something more serious. Well, I know that that girl that went out to, was it Schenectady or somewhere, that didn’t know that those people were Seventh Day Adventists, and she went to one of their meetings, and she came back! They were Lithuanian, and they belonged to Father Batetty’s church. And Father Battetty was worth knowing, really. As far as I am concerned, he was a marvelous priest. He was priest from head to toe. But if there was something he had to tell you, he told it to you. He even took sides. And for all the years that he was here in the United States, he still had that broken English. So she went to Confession to him. She told him what was bothering her. So she told him that she attended this meeting, and Father said to her, Don’t you know that you are NOT to attend meetings like that? He said, supposin’ you would have

page_0015

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -15- 7/23/72 Tape 23-2

[756 in margin]

HF: been weak-willed, and you would have fallen for all that, and you would have left the Church? He said, do you realize what a horrible sin that would be? So, she said, you know Helen, they say, don’t ever tell your penance. I said, That’s right, that’s what they say, don’t ever tell your penance. Well, she said, I’m gonna tell you what I got. I had to say fifteen decades of the rosary as my penance!

AV: That must have taken a while?

HF: Not if you concentrate on it, not if you concentrate on it, it didn’t take that long. One, one ros–well, the five decades, and in our way of saying beads you mention the mystery at the end of every Hail Mary, and if it’s said in English, you just mention that mystery at the beginning of the decade, and then you just pray the straight Hail Mary, but not in ours. If you want to say it the way the rosary should be said, then you mention the mystery at the beginning of every bead, and it takes about a half hour to say the five decades. So really, if you concentrate on it, it wouldn’t take so terribly long. But she had to say fifteen decades. He wanted to impress her with the seriousness of that.

[785 in the margin]

page_0016

Angela Varesano 7/21/72 Helen Fedorsha

Her mother used to say that when the weather is hot and humid-like, that’s when milk spoils faster.

“Fatty Maroots,

Lost his boots;

Didn’t know where to find them.”

This was a rhyme that she and her friends used to say when they were children to make fun of fat people. She used this at a plump dog that she is fond of feeding.

Some girls went to high school in Freeland. They had to walk to Foundryville and get the train from there to Free land. A lot of younger girls, after getting out of school after eighth grade, used to do house work for homes in Hazleton. They also used to do house work for homes in Jeddo and the boarding house there. Not many girls went to high school since it meant a trip out of town every day. This walk to Foundryville was considered somewhat dangerous, even when Helen was young. She’s sixty-nine now.

“We used no budget book, you know, just about how much you’d be getting. So you just bought what you need, just the necessities.” Helen thinks that the rest of the people didn’t keep budget books. At least she doesn’t know of any one keeping this. “You’d buy what you need.” Things you needed were food, clothes, and things to fix or replace in the house.

They didn’t often use credit. Her parents said, “Don’t buy if you can’t meet your payments. It’s a disgrace if they come to take your furniture away.” They preferred to pay cash on all purchases. The family never used the company store credit. Some people bought everything needed there. Mr. Reese often had bills that people wouldn’t pay after extending them credit. “There were a number of people who never paid off their bill.”

In the beginning miners used the Markle Bank in Hazleton. He was a big coal operator long before Helen’s time. The miners were told at work to deposit at the Markle Bank. Her father changed banks after he retired in 1948. He used the Citizen’s Bank of Freeland.

Her father talked to Emil Lang “in our way” (Slavic), and explained things so arrangements could be made for the use of funds by Helen in case of her parents’ death or ill ness. She reassured her parents that she’d never, and they knew it, draw from their account. She told them that even if something happened that they’d have to go through all their money, she’d take care of them as long as she

page_0017

Angela Varesano 7/21/72 Helen Fedorsha

was alive and working.

Later she paid her mother and father’s funeral expenses since the rest of the family were married and had families. She’d been working since age fourteen and always used to turn over her check to her mother. Her mother would give her some money if any was left after necessities were bought. If there were, she’d get some; if not, she wouldn’t.

Helen paid for a death benefit from her father. This policy for $500 was begun after the retirement of her father. It was finally paid to her “quite a few years” after her father’s death. Her brothers and sisters did not object to her getting the benefits since they didn’t pay for the funeral of her parents.

Her father retired at over seventy years old when he couldn’t “make it up the slope” or walk up the slope. Older men did retire late. There wasn’t asthma pension, miners’ pen sion, or unemployement or black lung compensation. There was only Social Security, and he worked a few years under that. When he couldn’t make it up the slope, he wanted to quit. He told Mr. Crabtree through a boss.

Crabtree said, “You’re not quitting!

Father said, “Well, I have no choice.”

Then Crabtree said, “You’re not quitting. I’m laying you off.” this was so he could collect unemployment pension. When asthma pension came in, the men started to retire at sixty-five. The problem was that Social Security wasn’t enough to support a family. The men worked as much as they could for the money necessary to run the household.

Old people always got respect. You were taught to respect them. They called an older person vy [this is followed with “ve” with a line over the letter “e”] as though addressing more than one person. To an ordinary person one used ty or the singular you. Respect was indicated by the address form used, not contradicting them at all, listen ing to what they said, and not making fun of them. “After all, they knew more than you did. They lived through it.” They (older people) had to improvise as they went along, as they came to the new place here, things the young wouldn’t know where to start and “how to deal with.”

You were taught at home to respect your elders. The parents taught this. Children took care of their own par ents. A lot were dissatisfied, especially if they were married and the husband didn’t like it. But you never heard of anyone being put in a nursing home. If one daughter were unable to accomodate the parent, another would take care of them until death. The parent stayed with whichever

page_0018

Angela Varesano 6/28/72 Helen Fedorsha

The kerosene peddler was dirty from the fluid and had black clothes. He had a tank or wagon drawn by two horses. It was a box type wagon, not high, with spigots in the back for different priced grades of kerosene. There were two spigots. Kerosene was also sold in the country store. They bought it there after the man stopped coming. It was stored in a back room. The peddler stopped coming before the first war. She remembers it as 1910, when she was six years old, probably between 1910 and 1914.

The ice cream man was an Italian man who sold Hokey Pokey Ice Cream. He had penny cones, nickel cones, and walked pushing a cart. The cart was like a barrel set in a frame.

[There is a drawing of an upright cylinder on wheels, identified as “Barrel with ice cream”, with curved upright handles above it joined by a “handle bar”. The top of the barrel has a horizontal line through its middle. The front half is identified as “ice cream section”. The back half has vertical marks, creating sections. One section is identified as “nickel cones” and another as “penny cones”. The left wheel is identified as “front wheel”. There is a line at the bottom edge of the wheels representing the ground. The barrel is described as 3 feet in height.]

A man called Mr. Zimmerman had a wagon with curtains on the side and a flat roof made of slats on the inside. On a nice day he would roll up the curtains to give a good view of his wares. He sold kitchen utensils such as pots, pans, rolling pins, possibly tin dishes, buckets, copper wash kettles, and wash boards. He stopped coming maybe before World War I.

[There is a side-view drawing of a wagon, its front facing the right side of the page. The wagon appears to be a buckboard type of wagon with a frame holding curtains above the box. In the upper left corner of the frame a spiral is drawn, described as “Canvas curtain, rolled up & fastened”. Across the top of the frame is what appears to be a curtain that pulled up and strapped in two places to the top of the frame. The right strap has the description: “strap fastener of canvas curtain”. Below this fastener is drawn a “frying pan hanging from a hook” from the ceiling of the wagon frame. To the right of the bottom box part of the wagon is a small extension with a curved top edge, described as “front of wagon, seat & feet rest”.

page_0019

Angela Varesano 6/15/72 Helen Fedorsha

To make kreplee take enough dough for one loaf of bread. Roll it out about a half-inch thick into a twenty-five inch circle. Cut into squares. Separate. Fry in hot oil in the bottom of a frying pan. Hot is when the dough is put in and “they right start boiling.” Turn over when they are done on one side. They are done on one side when they begin to arch and the bottom is golden brown. When all are done, they are put into sugar in a bag and shaken to coat them with sugar. She dumps them into a large bag then throws in sugar and shakes back and forth.

6/24/72

There was a porch between the original kitchen and shandy or summer kitchen. It had no roof, just planks about six inches wide. It had a little frame on the bottom, first, and planks were tacked on. The man of the house built it. The company gave the lumber when they were told it was needed. Nick Campbell would bring lumber by mules and wagon–the box type with two mules. He would also deliver the coal and shovel it into the coal shed. The porch width varied with taste. In Helen’s Back Street house it was about two to two and a third yards wide. Some painted the window casings dark green in stead of black. Some would have long planks; some had it cut into short, two feet pieces laid parallel.

page_0020

Angela Varesano 6/10/72 Helen Fedorsha

She bought her mixing pan from a tea man as one of his specials. He was from Hazleton and worked for the Jewel Tea Company. He came once a week to homes and sold tea and coffee. When you bought, you got a card. As you paid, it was marked down, and you got “credit”. After you got so much credit, you could get dishes, tablecoths, and now even clothes free. He has good stuff–“His rice was nice; his coffee good.” When her parents died, she couldn’t use many things in one week so she stopped. He still comes into town. He started dealing about 1953. These men were around before then, however.

In baking bread, the flour is sifted the previous night and put inside the house to keep it warm. The flour bin is in the corner of the shandy outside the kitchen door. It is a three-foot high, twenty inches wide cylinder which holds a fifty pound bag.

Three small potatoes are boiled. Yeast is dissolved in lukewarm water. Warm water is used beause cold retards the action of the yeast. The yeast is mixed around with a knife by scraping it all away from the edges.

The flour is put into a basin about twenty-four inches wide and ten inches deep. A finger-hold full of salt is added along with less than a cup of sugar using a tin cup, two table spoons of Crisco using a knife tip to measure, and about four heaping tablespoons full of lukewarm potato. If too much Crisco is added the bread becomes crumbly. Mix the contents in the basin with hands using a squeezing motion while push ing towards the middle.

One cup of lukewarm water is put in a bowl. The yeast is added by pouring it into the basin middle. This is mixed a bit. Some water is added and this is mixed with a squeezing motion, sweeping the sides with a handful of matter and squeezing in the middle. More water is added unless the matter is squishy. It is beaten with a clawing and stirring motion as the basin is tilted with the left hand.

Flour is added a little at a time. It is mixed by gather ing the sides and punching in the middle, by taking one edge in both hands and squeezing a handful in towards the middle. If it sticks to your hands, it is too soft and you have to add more flour:

“Now, then, this is too soft.”

“What tells you?”

“Well, when it sticks to your hands.”

Everything described before “wouldn’t set the dough unless you knead it.” Use the heel of the palm to turn dough bot tom-side up. This process is called settin’ the dough. It is kneaded until the hands are clean and not sticky. You can tell it’s soon done because “it’s getting smooth.” Another

page_0021

Angela Varesano 6/10/72 Helen Fedorsha

name for kneading is stiffening the bread.

The dough is pulled together from the edges into the center into a round. Just before covering the bread with a cloth, she makes the sign of the cross over it so it will bake. “I guess the bread would bake without it, but the sign of the cross never hurts. I do it again just before I put the bread into the oven.”

She places two blankets on the table and puts the pan in the center. She covers it by overlapping the edges over the dough so it doesn’t get chilled. If it does, the bread wouldn’t be any good. In the winter she puts a bench in back of the stove in the kitchen. In the shandy she puts a board or plank on buckets in back of the stove. It raises for two hours.

After two hours the bread is punched. She does this by unwrapping the bread and punching it down, getting it away from the sides over the center. She takes handfuls, squeezes them, and pushes them into the center. The bread is turned bottom-side up. Then it is put back to raise for another hour covered with a cloth.

The bread board is brought in from the summer shandy to warm it up. Everything used on or in the bread dough must be warm, or it will spoil the bread. The old bread board her mother used was made by one of the boarders on Back Street. The present one was bought at the Leader Store. Another was made by her nephew. The board made by the boarder seemed to be made of floor boards. They had it for a long time. It was about three feet by two and a half feet.

After it raised for one hour, she made the sign of the cross over each loaf with her hand as she put it in the oven. As it bakes, she keeps turning it. When it is taken out, it is cooled on a rack or table or on the stove. It is brushed with browned margarine. When I asked for a piece of fresh bread, she said, “No, don’t cut it now. It’s hot. Our mother always told us, ‘Don’t eat hot bread. It’s not good for you.’

[There is a drawing below this, with the description “bread board styled by Helen Fedorsha’s mother, made by one of the boarders”. It is a rectangle, drawn in the shape of a parallelogram (as if you’re viewing it from above and at a slight angle). There are irregular horizontal lines drawn within the parallelogram, appearing to represent wood. Coming off the left side is a curved line that extends only a little past the side, the ends of it beginning and ending about a third of the way from either end of that side. On the top of the board there is what appears to be a narrow upright piece (it looks a bit like an upright ruler). It extends front to back on the board, and also has a curved piece on the top of its middle third, which appears to be about the same height as the upright piece it’s on top of).]

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Angela Varesano 6/10/72 Helen Fedorsha –7–

Maybe it was to keep the bread from being eaten all at once, but that’s what she always said.” She made the sign of the cross over the bottom with a knife just before cutting me the first slice.

Her mother used to say that the use of potatoes and potato water kept the bread fresher.

If you add too much flour, it would be too stiff. You correct this by adding water to the side and making a paste. You then work it into the dough.

In making cabbage pie, the cabbage is chopped straight downward with a knife using a downward motion. Then it is chopped across the mound, and the sides are pushed into the center to chop. The water is squeezed out and the cabbage placed in browned margarine. It cooks in the margarine by stirring it until it gets tender, after about a half hour on the front of the stove.

In preparation for baking, the stove is shaken down and chestnut coal added for a strong fire. Her mother always used “pea coal” to hold the fire better.

Using bread dough she pulls out a chunk and cuts it with a knife using short, quick strokes of a sharp knife. She cuts about five balls and puts them on a floured board. She kneads each by overlapping the front edge and squeezing down in the center and rolling twice. This is done nine times. She squeezes the edges to the middle to form a flat ball, alternating side and front edges when kneading. The board is covered with an oil cloth bottom.

The pans are warmed by placing them on the front edge of the stove. They are greased with Crisco and a brush. Loaves are formed by squeezing the edges into the center and pinching. These are placed on back of the stove to raise for one hour, covered. She places the dough pinched-side down.

To form cabbage pies, the mounds are flattened, picked up, and stretched into circles of about twelve inches. About one and a third cups filling are put into each. They are sprinkled with flour, covered, and allowed to raise for a while. They are then flattened with the heel of the palm, rolled out lightly, and bake in a bare oven.

[At the bottom of the page, there is a drawing of a head of cabbage, stem facing up. There are six small arrows encircling the cabbage, pointing counter-clockwise. There is a line drawn through the top of the cabbage, just under the stem, with the words “cut off” written next to it.]

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Angela Varesano 6/6/72 Helen Fedorsha –8–

Cabbage Pie:

the cabbage in the center. Gather up the edges. Put the gathered side down on an oil cloth. (Take oil cloth, reversed.) For fifteen to thirty minutes, as it raises, it evens out. Flatten with heel. Use rolling pin lightly to make it one inch thick. Put in a hot oven or “bare” oven. Make gashes in the top for steam to escape. Brush with browned margarine after it is done.

Coal picking was always done after school. When there was no school, it was done all day. They used to dump a car load of coal that had slate in it on the slate bank. This is where the breaker is built. (The movie prop breaker is referred to.) There was an open space in the center of the bank. It seemed to have been crescent-shaped. One used an implement to crack large pieces of coal. Her brother, who worked in the blacksmith shop as a helper, made it. You would dig with the pointy end into the bank, digging a hole. The pieces were put into a burlap bag. The bag was rolled down the bank when it was full. The express wagon pulled it home. A wheel barrow was also used.

[There is a drawing of a wagon, titled “Express wagon–wood”. It is a hand-pulled wagon, drawn from the side, with the front facing the right side of the page. The box part of the wagon is rectangular in shape, its sides described as five inches in height. There is a steering rod with a handle on the end of it extending from the right, or front side, described “movable steering rod (may have been here)”. Two wheels with spokes are seen beneath the box of the wagon. There is a separate drawing of a wheel, below and to the right of the wagon drawing, with the rounded edge facing forward. It is titled “iron wheel detail”. The wheel is described as 1 1/2 inches wide, and has the description “tin band” beside it. Below the drawing of the wagon, there is a drawing of two wheels connected by an axle, described as “front wheel connected”.

Reaction to my hiccup:

Angela: “Hic!”

Helen: “Someone’s talking about you.”

Angela: “Really?”

Helen: “Well, you have hiccups.”

Angela: “Well, I hope it’s something nice.”

Helen: “I do too.”

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Angela Varesano 6/6/72 Helen Fedorsha

Elderberries The bush has white blossoms. As they mature, they develop green berries. When they ripen, they are black an bitter. Some people used to make wine from the berries. They can be put in apple jelly to make it tasty. Some men made wine. The and pure alderberry jelly are good for a cold. One year they found in the alley by the garage. At present, they are located in the woods.

Emro (Emory) Nicholas was a carpet maker. He lived on Back Street. The ones who came from Europe knew how to weave and did their own cloth. Helen’s mother said that (women) they were always busy in the evening during winter. They would gather in a home and weave and the men told stories. Nicholas used to work for short odds and ends. People from out of town used to come to him. He had an outside shandy he used as his loom place.y are meas

Rags were prepared for Emro. They used dress material from old dresses or men’s shirts or almost any knid of material. Wool was avoided because it shrinks. Carpets were washed in warm water, and if wool is mixed in with cotton, it will shrinks. Pieces one and a half inches wide were cust and sewn.

All should be of the same color that are together. They are rolled into balls. The balls are arranged in the way the colors are to be mixed. They are measured by holding it in the thumb and forefinger to the nose. Balls of one color should be arranged in each box. A measure is taken. Strips should be thin. The should not be too wide. Sew where they are cut.

1. 2. 3. 4.

Stitch back and forth with hand or by machine.

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Angela Varesano 6/5/72 Helen Fedorsha

Mr. Reese was the owner of the company store. He and Miss Smith, the town nurse, shared the Coxe house and the edge of town. He would extend credit during strikes, e.g. the seven-month strike of 1902. Some would take advantage of his kindness and not pay him. At on time a used to break in and steal.

The Eckley General Store as right above John Fatula’s. There were many goods in stock, from the wardrobe in Helen Fedorsha’s front bedroom to shoes. The post office was also in Reese’s store. Mr. Bougman and Bridgie O’Donnell were hired as clerks in the post office part.

Dry goods sold included rice and coffee. the interior had shelves all around. The dry goods were kept in big bins. A scoop was used to get them out, and there was a scale to measure them. The length of one wall had storage bins built right against it. There were also candy and knife cases and a medicine shelf. Beside the post office cage there was later a telephone. Shanky’s got a telephone (next door to Denion’s). They and Maloney’s were the first with telephones. These were used only for emergency calls such as the priest or doctor.

Cottage “cow” cheese, sugar, and eggs are the ingred ients for cheese pie. Bread dough is rolled out and put on a pie plate. The filling is put on top. The edges are pulled back over the cheese. The dough is brushed with beat en egg and a little milk. Sometimes raisins are added to the cheese. Helen thinks this “makes the bread stale quicker.” She tried it with sour cream and shredded coconut mixed in and liked it.

Bake oven (drawn by Angela Varesano with directions from Helen Fedorsha)

roof

“paddle”

clay, domed top

heavy iron on bottom of oven

bricks using clay 3′

oven door, maked of “heavy iron” put up against the oven to keep it closed

roof covering had open back, closed sides/oven had retangular base

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Angela Varesano 6/4/72 Helen Fedorsha

While waiting for the oatmeal water to boil, she said, “They say a watched pot never boils; so I’d better not watch it.” Helen picked up food fallen on the floor “before the ants come in. Then I’d have to put salt for the ants.” She be lieves that salt will chase ants from the house.

Cabbage rolls/Filled cabbage:

From Helen’s mother. Most people make it with tomatoes now. Some used sour cream on the bottom and top of the pot and then pour melted and browned crisco or margarine on top of the cabbage rolls.

Scald the cabbage by cooking in boiling water for five minutes. Remove rthe center core from the head of cabbage. Drop it in boiling water. Cook this till it is soft enough to break the leaves off without breaking the leaves. Cut off the leaf “core” so it is easier to roll.

Mix some half-cooked rice, about two cups, with a pound and a half of ground beef. Mix it together with salt and pepper. Some put in onions. It is good with the juice of an onion. To come across a piece is not to tasty. Add two eggs. These help to keep it from falling apart after it’s cooked. Mix this by hand with a kneading motion digging up from the side of pot and punching into the center.

Take a wooden spoon full of the mix and place it in the middle of a leaf held in the left palm.

1.

leaf

mixture

2.

Rolled up

3.

Pushed in ends

Arranged in the bottom of the pot:

Shred or slice thin some cabbage for the top in the center. Cover it after salting it. She puts one quart of tomatoes, pulp and seeds broken up, on top. These are placed in the pan first cooked with a medium (15 oz.) can of Hunt’s Tomato Sauce and a half can of water. This is stirred up and poured over the rolls. This is ready to cook. More water may be added as it cooks. It is cooked on the back center of the coal stove till done.

Some people call it “pigs in blankets”. (Anne Fedorsha Falatko)

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Angela Varesano 6/6/72 Helen Fedorsha

Mushrooms (red toppers) Look for them under fallen leaves and under trees. The stems are thick, and they must be Scraped before using to the black scale off. Their caps have light brown colors and the underside is white.

To cook: Cut them up and wash them. If they are thick, slice several pieces lengthwise. Cook them in water with parsley for flavor. When they are still crisp, drain. Brown butter. Add cooked mushrooms. Stew for a while. Add eggs and scramble in a pan. When it settles, it is ready to eat.

Mushroom soup (dried mushrooms) It is customary to serve these on Christmas Eve in her family. Scrape and string on a cord from a flour bag using a needle. Tie the string. Hang it in back of the stove near the pipes. The heat will dry them. When they are dry, they are crisp. Put them aside in a paper bag.

To cook: Soak in water. Drain several times. Chop on a board using vertical chops. GEt saurkraut juice from a can or barrel. Boil this with some water. Drop “mushies” in and cook. Make a light “rue.” Let this brown. Put the rue in the mushrooms. Some used to put mushies into the saurkraut. Eat this with mashed potatoes and dip it into the soup.

Poisonous mushrooms The cap is just straight across. Under neath is like pleats. Their color is yellowish. Look at them, and can tell they can’t be good-can sense it.

Edible mushrooms (potpinky) These grow around an oak stump. You can get many in a good place. They are very fragile. “If you see other than red tops, you don’t take them.”

Elderberry tea This is good for colds. It is made from dried blossoms kept in a bag. Brew tea, add sugar, and drink.

Olian tea This is also good for colds. She used to go up around the engine house to pick the leaves.

Bread and butter vine This had berries. It was found by climbing trees. They were found in Highland on the short cut at the breaker and boiler houses. Just before the tracks, the vines were found on nearby trees. They have a broad leaf. It is good eating leaf two to three inches long. The taste is a little on the sour side. If you are thirsty, the water in the leaf takes away the thirst. An old leaf is bitter.

Teaberry This is a low bush. It has little red berries. The leaves are dark green and shiny, and th berries are fleshy.

Indian bananas This is a fern, When pulled the root has a banana taste. It is a long white root. It used to be found down by th old picnic ground near the back of Emil Gera’s in that alley. The bush is about two feet high.

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Angela Varesano 6/3/72 Helen Fedorsha –13–

Cheese was made from fresh, warm milk. A crock of milk was warmed over the back of the stove. When it curdled, it was put into a cloth and squeezed into a ball, squeezing the water out.

Sheep milk cheese or brenza was curdled by a piece of stomach of a milk-fed calf.

Sour milk was coagulated to the consistency where “you can almost cut it with a spoon…not like yogurt.” It seems to be something like a custard.

Butter was also made at home from fresh cow’s milk. The milk was allowed to stand in a crock. The cream was skimmed off the top with a spoon. This was put into another crock until enough cream was accumulated for churning.

Krepti: This was made by raising, rolling, and cutting bread dough into one inch squares. They are allowed to raise and then fried in hot oil while turning them to do both sides. They are shaken in a pan with sugar to coat them. A variation is to put pitted prunes into the squares and pull the ends together before frying.

Hrutki: This is a special Easter cheese and paska is an Easter bread.

Lokshi are thin pancakes of mashed potatoes and flour with browned margarine over them.

Pirohi: These are filled with prunes or mashed potatoes and American cheese. They are used in the Christmas Eve celebration.

Cabbage pies are made of bread dough, cottage cheese, eggs, and stewed cabbage.

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Angela Varesano 8/12/72 Helen Fedorsha –14–

A lady used to come around selling ladies’ underwear, knitted underwear. These included vests for under the dresses, pan ties, underpants bloomers. Towards the winter she’d sell long underwear with legs and sleeves.

Snuggies were knitted underwear like underpants that fitted close and extended from the waist down to the knee. “Suggies” is the store name for them. The best store for these was Deisroth’s in Hazleton.

The ladies’ underwear peddled in Eckley was not expensive for the family. Corsets were bought in Hazleton stores such as Zimmerman’s, and the lady of the house used to wear them even when she did housework. This was a protection.

“Vests” were worn even by little girls, besides women. It was worn in summer and winter, the winter ones being heavier to absorb perspiration. A slip was worn on top; almost everyone had slips and panties made of flour sacks.

[There is a drawing of what looks like a tank top, sideways on the page with the shoulder straps on the left side, with the word “VEST” written under it. There are dotted lines drawn around the neck and arm holes, and a bow, drawn as a horizontal “8” with two short curved lines extending below it, is drawn in the center and below the top line of the neck hole.]

As far as clothes as a status display goes, Helen said every one in town was alike. You wore your best clothes for the visit to Mrs. Cox at Christmas time. Ordinarily, the clothes worn were homemade and were what could be afforded. They were not fancy, nothing made of silk. The children in school did not envy the better clothes or ornaments of their school mates because they recognized that others had more money and were able to afford better clothes. There was no jealousy, and no child demanded anything that he knew his family couldn’t afford.

There was no downgrading of different nationalities in school she says. No one thought you were less because you were Slavish or Dutch or Irish. Everyone was equal and treated each other equal.

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Angela Varesano 6/5/72 Helen Fedorsha

She was telling about ther father and how he went to Scranton to look for work in the mines when there was a lay off in Eckley. The boss told him, “Well, go down and ask the miners if they need help.” So he went down to ask each of the miners. He had his oil lamp with him. As he was walking from one section to another, he ran out of oil. Becasue he was in a strange mine without light, he tried to feel his way back. He heard water, but he didn;t know where it was. While he was feeling his way, he found some barrels. He saw light and heard some men coming. He walked on the barrels which made noise, and the men said, “It haunts.” They thought it was the ghosts of men who died in the mines. He called out in Slavish, but they ran when they heard the noise. So he was left in the dark with no light, and he thought, “Well, this is where I’m going to end up.” He tried to go along. Pretty soon he heard another man coming, saw a light, and called out to him in English (he didn’t have too much English at the time.), and showed him that he didn’t have anyore oil. The man gave him some of his own.

She once had a nose bleed. Mr. Bennie Schupeck said, “Go get the rind of bacon and put it under your upper lip.” On a slab of bacon is the skin of the pig or the rind. It is the smoked part. This is the part used. The rind is found only on slab bacon.

Boarders sat aroung on benches made by the men of the house. They did some help. Each had his own matress of straw. When they left, they took it with them.

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Denis Mercier 6/4/72 Helen Fedorsha

Kid on Back Street played ring around the rosie, London bridges, and nipsy or bridges, and nipsy or nipsies. Game: Dro nipsay into circle. Hit tapered end with a paddle and the nipsy flies into the air. Then it is hit out of the circle with the paddle. Everyone takes a turn. the nipsy farthest out of the circle wins.

For berry picking people carried sugared bread and a water jar. These were wrapped in firns in a cool place to stay cool while berries were picked. They were ties on the small of the back by a band or bands of cloth which was the same as that used to fasten the berry cap to the stomack area and later to carry the full cans on the back and shoulders.

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Angela Varesano 8/11/72 Helen Fedorsha

Her father used to make a scrub brush or “little mop” to clean and scrub glass jars used in food canning. He made it out of a stick (round) and a bunch of flannel strips on the top of it, secured by means of a large wooden bead or nut. The bunch of strips was tied to make a scrubbing brush.

Scrub Brush

4″

18″

Average strip length 4″

He also made pastry brushes from certain types of goose feathers, the kind plucked from the tail feathers. He wove them together on a string and a bunch for use in greas ing bread pans and tops of fresh bread after it’s done. It was also used for brushing nut and poppy seed rolls with beat en eggs.

The feathers were from geese raised at home and plucked from live geese. You had to be careful not to pluck off certain important wing feathers, or it would be temporarily unable to get around well. Her family kept geese mainly for their feathers and their use in feathr ticks.

The pastry brush used to brush beaten eggs onto panned nut rolls and buns to give a browned crust with a shiny fin ish. Butter is brushed onto bread that’s freshly baked to soften the crust. Margarine can be used instead. Some people use water, but she prefers margarine.

Helen used to spent several nights toward the end of summer, after she came home from work, canning what produce there was which was ripe. Since her mother was infirm and bedfast she did the work with the assistance of her father. He washed the bottles, scrubbing them in water and soap with his homemade brush.

When Helen came home from the factory at about 5:00, she prepared the family dinner. They were finished at 6:oo. After the dishes were done, she prepared and canned the food. Her father would peel the tomatoes before she came home, if they were canning tomatoes. Sometimes the produce would take so land that at 2:00 AM she would be just washing dishes.

Usually they canned tomatoes, carrots, bread and butter pckles, beets, chow-chow, applesauce, tomato ‘ulec, and stewed tomoates with peppers.

For stewed tomoatoes with peppers: Cut up big “ball” peppers Stew them in oil. Fine-cut the onion and peppers and stew for

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/Angela Varesano 8/11/72 Helen Fedorsha

Stewed Tomatoes with Peppers

a while. Add the tomatoes. If they’re fresh, take and scald them and peel them. Cust out the core and cut into pieces. If canned, you don’t have to add salt to season. Stew on the back of the stove to tomato juice is absorbed. cook till it’s thick as you want. Put into prepared jars and seal.

Serve with meat and potatoes or with mashed potatoes or with bread alone.

Canning was intermittent on non-consecutive nights, so she canned whenever the got ripened.

Canned beans:

Wash and cut up the beans. REmove the ends and cut in half or in three pieces if they’re longer.

Wash the jars by scrubbing with a brush in soapy water. Keep on the stove on a cookie sheet to keep warm.

Cook for five minutes. Pick them out of the pot and put the beans in jars. Add water, boiling water to the top, and a half teaspoon of salt per pint. Dip the lids in hot water and put them on the jars. Seal. Put them on a rack in the canner. Boil for one hour. Cool and store in the cellar. Helen uss Ball jars, Kerr jars, and Mason jars.

page_0040

AV inter. H. Fedorsha -1- 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

AV: Tell me about these wakes they used to have before

HF: Well we’d go to a wake and sit there a good part of the night, just talkin’ that was the custome there were certain people that stayed all night long ’till it would be day break then they would go home because then everyone was laid out at home they wanted to lay out the funeral home (?) and some would tell stories to keep the others from sleepin’ and that’s how the wakes went but when someone was sick and belonged to a lodge they would have members of the lodge relieve the family so the family could get rest they would have to go and the president of the lodge would pick out certain members and he would come to their homes and tell them they’d have to go that night a sit with this person to give the family a rest and they’d do that and the next night he’d pick someone else there was 2 men picked at a time and they’d do that ’til the person showed improvement and that the family didn’t have to sit up all night so that was a good part of it because it was somethin’ you don’t see being done anymore you’re either hauled off to the hospital or you’re at home and too many times your own family doesn’t help out your very immediate family at the house they have no choice they have to help out but if you have any one that any one that is living away from the home they very seldom show up, just the very immediate family takes care but today as soon as you get a headache the doctor sends you off to the hospital you don’t stay at home

AV: Who used to go to these wakes and tell stories

HF: Well Mr. Lesher used to, he was a good story teller, his first name was Mike he came, he wasn’t livin’ in this town too long, I don’t know did they come from

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AV inter. H.F. -2- 6/22/72 Tape 13

at the time and then after his death some time after that the family moved to Freeland and they’re living in Freeland now

AV: Did he come from across

HF: Uh huh, both he and his wife come fromacross now whether they were married here in America I don’t know because all of their children are American born so it could be that they were married here in America that I don’t know but both of them cam from across

AV: Was he living near you

HF: Yes when they first came they were living just a few homes above me not far and they were very nice people, I don’t think anybody ever had any trouble with them, if you met up with them they talked they didn’t give you a hard time they got along with the neighbors and all they were very nice people

AV: What did he do

HF: He was a miner

AV: What made his special from anybody else, did he just get this ability by himself

HF: Well he was a good talker and whereever he got around the men and had about one or two drins then he could talk and then there was always men that would keep on talkin’ so he would talk more They’d keep on tellin’ how good he is and he would tell the stories so that kept everyone else awake and you wanted that at a wake you didn’t want anyone sleepin’

AV: So what would happen when there was a wake, how would he be notified

HF: Oh it was only if thre was a wake here in town, well then naturally everyone knew when anyone in town died everyone knew that that particular person is dead and people really went to the wakes at that time and they felt it was their duty not only their neighborly duty but their Christian duty to go to a wake and they did that no matter how far away, if you were living at one end of the town and they were at the other end of town you still went, but today they don’t do that anymore

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6/22/72 Tape 13-2 –3– inter. H F

AV: How long did they usually stay

HF: Well some of them would stay until daylight, daylight would start breakin’

AV: Which ones would this be

HF: It was the more hearty ones that stayed or if they didn’t have to go to work the next day if they went to work the next day they’d leave early so that they could get some sleep before they went to work

AV: It wouldn’t be just the immediate relations that would stay late

HF: No there were some outsiders that would stay late also, but already now a few years back it was mostly the relatives that would stay up all night if the body was laid out at home and in the funeral home they very seldom would want to stay all night even if the funeral home would be open they didn’t stay, around 9 o’clock, after 9 o’clock they’d start clearin’ out the majority would leave just the very immediate family would stay

AV: But in the old days

HF: In the old days everyone came and when my brother-in-law was killed when they took him from the mines they took him to the undertakers and the undertaker didn’t bring him back till pretty late that night he didn’t have any of the chairs in the house or anything and all of the neighbors, not just the close neighbors but the people in town that knew him, there were so many that came right that night and the body wasn’t there yet, they came and they sat on the floor and they waited and then after the undertaker brought the body home and he brought the chairs but every night, well every night he was laid out, well, he was only laid out, he was killed on a Thursday and was buried on Saturday but the place was filled to capacity every while he was laid out when he was brought home and the next night and then the funeral he did have a very large funeral, because the men that he worked with, he was a very nice person and he was very well liked and I don’t think there was any one atall that could have a mean word for him because he was a very well liked person.

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6/22/72 Tape 13-2 –4– AV inter H F

AV: If it was a miner did the people working with him in the mines were they expected to come

HF: They would come yes, but in this case one of the men was hurt and he wasn’t able to come not until after he was better and then he came to our Anna’s place and he sympathized with her and he spent some time with her and one of the men was killed with my brother-in-law and I don’t know whether that night shift came in or not but I think the whole town was there and even outsiders because when he started out he started out driving mules and he worked with men they’re still livin’ ’till today and they all had a lot of respect for him they all came so as far as we were concerned it was too much of a shock to have that happen but happen it did

AV: Were the co-workers of a miner supposedly, did they stay just as much as the immediate family

HF: Some of them stayed, not all because some had responsibilities at home or they had to go out to work in the morning so naturally they’d have to get their sleep because to go down in the mines whenever you’re not wide awake is just a little too dangerous

AV: And then which of the women would come

HF: Well as far as I know I think all of them would come now when my brother-in-law was killed and not only in his case a lot and in most of the cases, they would come immediately when they knew about it, they would take over and whatever work that had to be done in the house they would do it they would bring food in that you didn’t have to cook and they would even bring food in if people came you had what to serve them, and when my brother-in-law was killed they, well in a few minutes time there were so many, not only her immediate neighbors because she was living on the Back Street but even from the Main Street here there were women that came there to see what they could do for them and they took over

page_0044

6/22/72 Tape 13-2 –5– AV inter. HF

right away because she wasn’t able to do anything at all the shock was entirely too much for her and they helped out I can’t even mention all the women that came and helped out after that she said she was very much surprised that they were all so willing to come and help out but they were and they did that in almost every case, the women would help out

AV: How was she notified of the death

HF: If I’m not mistaken I think her brother-in-law came and told her that’s [handwritten illegible word] Falatko but he didn’t tell her he was killed but they wouldn’t have her go up to the colliery

AV: What did he tell her

HF: He told her he was covered, but I think they knew from the beginning that he wasn’t alive and I got a telephone call at the factory it was right around dinner time that I got the call and one of the Overlanders brought me home and it was a beautiful day nice sunny day and the next day it rained and rained, and the day of the funeral it rained but in the afternoon it cleared up

AV: What year was that

HF: 1935

AV: Then what was the custom to do after someone was killed they must have taken him up out of the mines, then what happened

HF: Well they would take him by ambulance to the funeral home and would ask who the undertaker is or if there was one of the family around they would ask and they would take them directly to the funeral home by ambulance

AV: By ambulance

HF: Well how else would they take them, they had to take them by ambulance, they’d take them by ambulance to Bobby McNulty’s and then of course Bobby would get in touch with the family and there was always someone who knew who your favorite undertaker was and that’s where they would take them

AV: Was Bob McNulty the only one

page_0045

6/22/72 Tape 13-2 –6– AV inter. HF

HF: He had both bodies my brother-in-law and the man that was killed with him

AV: Was he the only one in Freeland, this McNulty

HF: No, there was another one, Teriko’s [Jurica’s] and at that time I don’t think Petrilli was in business at that time, not until later years there was Teriko’s and McNulty

AV: What do you mean, your favorite undertaker

HF: Well everyone has favorites in that the same as everything else, oh yes if you knew a person and you knew just what they do and you knew how they worked things and didn’t overcharge you you’re going to stick with that person, now I know there’s one undertaker that, I know a party that had him and his wife and his family were in Europe, and this undertaker really took them over, because he had an attorney that was to take care of all his affairs, being that his wife and family were in Europe so he was going to take care of all of his affairs and between the 2 of them they really overcharged because I know the things that he didn’t buy and he had it on the bill and his attention was called to it and then soon after that there was a member of that family died in Bethlehem and we went to the wake and they had the very same casket that this man had the same make of casket so they asked what the price of it was and the price in Bethlehem was much cheaper than the price in Freeland and they said they’d never, never have that undertaker again, but with McNulty’s he did more charity than anybody will ever know he did charity that people never heard about and he said he’s dealin’ with workin’ people not millionaires and he would treat them as working people and his father before him did the same thing, his brother-in-law did the same thing, so I’m sure that Bobby got himself a crown because he did a lot of charity, he was a very gruff person you would talk to him and if you didn’t really know him and you would feel he was very hard to get along with very gruff but he wasn’t hard to get along with he was a nice person, very nice, we found

page_0046

6/22/72 Tape 13-2 –7– AV inter. HF

to be so and the way he handled the body, he had a lot of respect for that dead body, oh yes indeed he did, I saw an undertaker handle a body of a girl that died in a factory and I didn’t like it, I didn’t like it, she died at her machine fell over and died and then she didn’t have, her parents were dead, her brothers were all married and there was really no one that wanted to take charge so she laid on the floor in the factory for quite a while and they had her covered with coats and I would say it was almost 2 hours before an undertaker came because they couldn’t get anyone to give the word who the undertaker was to be, well then when the undertaker came instead of bringing that sort of a basket like, that thing that they put you into, instead of bringing that upstairs he came up the back steps, and he could have just as well carried that up, he came with another lad and of course after she died all the machines were stopped, and there was a lot of girls that didn’t want to work the rest of the day, well everyone was nervous over it then [blank] gave us so much time off to sort of recover and some of the girls went out and some of us stayed in and we were by the presser because the presser there was an order they had to get out and the presser had to work so we stood by the presser and this undertaker came up well the one man took her under the shoulders and the other one took her either, no not the knees, either the knees or the heels, I don’t know which but anyway most of her body sagged because she didn’t go into rigor mortis and her body sagged and I didn’t like that one bit, I just didn’t think that was right, I just couldn’t see it and I didn’t like that undertaker since then, well when Bobby came down for, when my mother died, that was my first experience he and his son came down and when they came in the room they took their hats off and the first thing they done was knelt down and prayed and then they took her off the bed and they wrapped her right in her own sheet and they had this rubberized sheet in this, I don’t know what you would call it, sort of a basket like thing, you know long, and I could see that her toes were touching this rubberized

page_0047

AV inter. HF -8- Tape 13-2 06/22/72

sheet, and I told Bobby about it I said, “Bobby don’t let her toes touch that rubberized sheet, I said she went thru so much I don’t want her toes near that rubberized sheet, “so he quick pulled the other sheet down and he understood how I felt about it but I must say that he had a lot of respect for a dead body both he and his son

AV: What did he pray

HF: They said Our Father and Hail Mary, and then they started to work and then after the body was prepared and they would get your o.k. on it, see if you were satis fied or anything you wanted changed, we went over to the funeral home and the priest was going to come down to bless the casket and then after he was done with his work and she was in on a cot along side of the casket and then after the priest was done with his work then we had to leave the room and they put her in the casket and arranged the body and then the hearse brought her down home and after they brought her in and Bobby’s daughter took over and she arranged the clothes and then after she was all done she called me in and asked me if I was satisfied with everything and was there any thing I wanted changed and I told her there was nothing I wanted changed only they had her hair pulled back a little too tight she always wore a ball on top of her head and they had it combed that way they had a hairdresser to fix them up and they had her hair combed the way she combed it but I thought they had it pulled too far from her face so I just put my hands like that and pulled it over for her and I use to do that when I combed her hair myself so then that night well a lot of the family came down and we sat up that night and I was going to set up all night long I wasn’t going to sleep, but with all the nights I didn’t have sleep I was sitting at the foot of the casket and before you knew it I was fast asleep and my dad told me you won’t be able to stay up all night and I said, Oh yes I’m going to stay up, but I didn’t and the rest of them in the morning when we got up when it started to break day light already and we could walk around in the shanty there, there was a few

page_0048

AV Inter. HF -9- 06/22/72 Tape 13-2

of them sprawled out on the couch and a few of them were on chairs but it was the immediate family

AV: How immediate

HF: Well my nephews, brother John, brother Pete, and then our Anna, Anna was up here all night and our little Anna wasn’t because her Joseph was small at that time

AV: What year was that

HF: That was 1958

AV: So the Back Streeet was gone already

HF: Oh yes we were living here then we were living here quite a few years when she died

AV: Where was she laid out

HF: At home

AV: What room

HF: The Parlor

AV: Was it the custom not to have the feet towards the door or how did they have it

HF: They had the face facing East the body facing East

AV: Why

HF: Well I don’t know if they are in all cemeteries but they are in St. Mary’s they’re laid in the cemetery facing East because the thing that I heard years ago is that when our Lord comes the second time as he will come that is a true fact even tho some deny it there is going to be the second coming of Christ and when he does come he is going to come from the East

AV: Who told you that

HF: I read about it in a book and I was told about it in church that he will come from the East and for that reason they bury the body that way so that all the dead are supposed to arise and they will all have, after you die there’s only a temporary judgment that you get they say that immediately when you die you get your temporary judgment but at the second coming of Christ you will get your

page_0049

06/22/72 AV inter HF -10- Tape 13-2

final judgment, and what I was taught I believe although some deny that it is going to be so, some claim that the body is not going to appear at that time only the soul but they claim that after you die the sould is the one that is judged but at the final judgment you appear in your body as you were and for the reason that the soul didn’t always commit the sin it took the body to agree with the sin, you know the soul in itself didn’t commit the sin, for that reason the sould shouldn’t take all the responsibility, the body should take some of it too, and that is what I heard in church and that is what I was taught and that’s what I believe and I don’t think there’s a scientist in the world that could make me change my thoughts, I never question what the church taught, there are a lot that will question why is this this way etc. but I don’t, I don’t question it what I was taught I believe and I hope to keep on believing it I don’t want to change those ideas

AV: And I’m sure that you wont, what all happened at the wake there, you mention people would serve refreshments

HF: Oh yes, the ones that were staying late if around midnight, you would make, there was a bunch of women that would make sandwiches and you’d have cake be cause the neighbors would bring more cake in that you could eat and then they use to bring other foodstuffs in also that the head of the home didn’t have to cook there were things there that the family could have for their meals during that while so you would make coffee and you’d have beer and some of the men would take a shot of liquor and then if they wanted beer or if they wanted coffee they would have it or sandwiches or a piece of cake or whatever they wanted, you would serve them because it was already after midnight and you knew that they were going to stay a good part of the morning

AV: What happened before midnight at the wake

HF: Well people usually just sat around and talked, smoked, you’d have cigarettes out there was always a bowl of cigarettes on the table and whoever smoked would

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06/22/72 AV inter HF -11- Tape 13-2

help themselves to the cigarettes, and they would talk among themselves, they would talk about their work, different things that would interest them, among themselves

AV: Who would sit in the casket room

HF: Well whoever came to the wake, and if they intended to stay for awhile they would sit in the room and usually one of the family would stay there in case anyone would come in and you would have to get up and greet them so if one left the other would stay

AV: Usually which member of the family was it

HF: Well in our case my dad was out here with the men and I stayed at the foot of the casket and I stayed there a good part of the time because a lot that would give for a mass and you would have to take their name and you had to keep track of the money

AV: Where would the people come in, which door

HF: They’d come in the back door, never thru the front and they would go out the back door also

AF Yeh, is that some special reason

HF: Well if there is too much of a crowd they would have the front door open but it was cold and that was in February and naturally we tried to keep the house as warm as we possibly could, well when my dad was dead that was in May that wasn’t so cold but even at that they came in the back way and went out that way

AF And then in that case your dad stayed in the kitchen with the men, right

HF: Well he would go to bed, he never stayed up as late as the men did, because he wasn’t in that condition that he could stay up so he would stay until about 10 o’clock and then I would take him upstairs and he’d go to bed and whether he fell asleep right away I don’t know because I came right down but he stayed in bed and he didn’t get up until morning because the doctor told him that he can’t stay up all night because his health wouldn’t hold out

page_0051

AV inter. HF -12- 06/22/72 Tape 13-2

AV: And you were napping there

HF: Oh yes I had my little nap there even tho I promised to stay up all night I didn’t do it

AV: And then who served the goodies at mignight

HF: Well I’d be around at that time, me and our Anna and John’s Margaret and if you didn’t have anyone from the family then some of the women that were in they would help, you didn’t make coffee in a perculator you made it in a pot/in an open pot and you served

AV: And you would actually leave these people in your house all night

HF: Oh yes, the lights were on all night long it was a custom and I think it was a good custom but today they’re falling away from it even in a funeral home when it’s around 9:30 to a quarter to 9, because usually the viewing is from 7 to 9 but at McNulty’s if you want to stay all night, the funeral home is open all night and you can do so, and around 8:30 a quarter of 9 when ones that aren’t the family start leaving and the ones that are left are mostly the family, when our Pete was laid out we were there quite late and we could have stayed as long as we wanted to, if we wanted to stay all night we could have stayed all night

AV: Who is this Pete

HF: My brother Pete

AV: How about when Anna’s husband was killed, that was at home right

HF: At home, we stayed up all night

AV: When did that story teller come in

HF: He came in the evening as usual, when almost everyone else was comin’ in and then if he was goin’ to work the next day he would usually stay ’till around midnight or if he wasn’t goin’ to work next day he would stay later but there were quite a number of story tellers but he was the most interesting but I don’t remember any of those stories that he told because there were so many of them and then

page_0052

AV inter. HF -13- 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

you wouldn’t always be sittin’ right where he is and if you were sittin’ in the other room you didn’t hear it

AV: Where did he usually tell the stories, in the men’s room

HF: Oh they were usually sittin’ in the kitchen, because the homes weren’t very big up where I lived there was only the parlor and the kitchen

AV: Who were other story tellers in the town

HF: Oh I wouldn’t know, because many times they would talk among themselves especially the ones that came from across they would tell their experiences over-seas and it was something new to us because we didn’t know about that

AV: What kind of things would Mike start out with, would somebody ask him to tell

HF: No just in the ordinary conversation they would just lead off to it, and the men would have a few jokes to tell and they would have their little laughs

AV: Dirty jokes

HF: Oh no, no dirty jokes

AV: They cleaned up for that occasion

HF: Yes indeed, yes indeed they showed respect to the body

AV: What kind of stories would he tell them

HF: Well usually at a wake they would tell ghost stories, that’s what they’d lead off with but I didn’t usually stay awake too long and get home a little sooner unless it was a friend or relative or that sort, then I would stay later but when the bunch was leavin’ you’d go because you’d be afraid to go home alone, you’d have to go when the bunch was leavin’ whoever was livin’ close to you and then when they were leavin’ you’d make it your duty to leave also you had friends to walk with and then you didn’t have to feel afraid to go home and you’d have to go in the dark because there wasn’t any lights in town you have to walk in the dark

AV: Do you remember anything about the stories he told

HF: No I don’t I don’t remember any of them, that is so long ago, really long ago

page_0053

AV inter HF 14 – 6/22/72 I don’t remember any of his stories Tape 13-2

AV: Would they be about some local dead people maybe

HF: No it would be, they had their stories in Europe and he would usually start out on those things but it was always a ghost story of some sort or other and then you’d have to be afraid to go home

AV: By ghosts do you mean like the spirit of the dead people type thing

HF: Yeh, they use to see things in Europe that we never seen in America, maybe more of their imagination than anything else

AV: What kind of things did they say they saw

HF: They said they saw spirits and I don’t believe it, I don’t think they saw spirits I think it was plain imagination just like in a lot of other things you may hear a noise of some sort you don’t see anything when you try to figure out what it is and you use your imagination it’s just a little too much and that’s what you’re goin’ to get

AV: What else did they imagine they saw beside spirits

HF: I really couldn’t tell you Angela because it really was a long time ago, long time ago, because they don’t do that anymore, at a funeral home you usually meet people that you didn’t see for awhile well then you talk about your own affairs and the men are usually in the back room at the funeral home like in a private home they were more combined, at a funeral home there are very few men who will set right in the funeral parlor if they want to smoke they won’t smoke in a funeral parlor they’ll go back into the back room and they smoke back there because they have all the conveniences there and they smoke back there so you don’t usually see them and you don’t carry on conversations with them, it is much different in the funeral home than it was in a private home

AV: These private homes were usually these 2 room things the kitchen that had the stairway to the upstairs and the parlor

HF: And then later they built an addition to it but still your kitchen was your kitchen

page_0054

home So the men in the kitchen they couldn’t see the casket in the parlor Well they didn’t care if they saw it or not, when they came in they paid their respects and then would go and sit and then vefore they went home they’d go over to the casket again, otherwise they (it) didn’t make too much difference to them And tell stories It’s just like now in the funeral home I usually meet people I didn’t see for awhile, well then you’re talkin'(talking) to them and eve tho(ugh) you are right in the room where the casket is you don’t pay too much attention to the casket anymore you'(re) talkin’ (talking) about your own affairs, you didn’t see someone maybe for years well the(n) you’re talkin'(g) about the times that are past, because last week I was to Mr. Washko’s and I met his daugter from Florida and his sister from Pottsville, I didn’t see her in oh gracious – years I didn’t see her so we were talkin’ (talking) about old times and we usually look for someone we didn’t see in a long time and then we talk about all the old times and it some of us ere friends at that time why we talk about those days just reminisce about old times. But in the old days, I’m surprised to hear that they told stories. Didn’t anybody pray.

page_0055

Interview HF 6/22/(19)72 -16 Even the immediate family

HF: Well there were outsiders that would sit there too, not just the immediate family there’d be friends and neighbors because in a town like this you would consider almost everyone your friend and people know one another they weren’t strange knout their doings and about their life and then they would talk about these things whatever interest (that) you had, you talked about then it wouldn’t be that you didn’t know the people and you didn’t know their way of life for anyting been in the same town for years and years you couldn’t help but knowing’ them

 AV: Was it mostly women in that room or not

 HF: No there would be men in there too but men usually stuck (snuck) to the kitchen because they smoked and they’d stuck (snuck) to the kitehen more than to the parlor

 AV: You wouldn’t smoke in the room where the casket was

 HF: No

 AV: Was this a religious custom?

 HF: What do you mean?

 AV: Not to smoke in the room with the casket

 HF: Well I don’t know whether it was for that reason or respect for the body. I don’t know but they didn’t smoke in that room.

 AV: Was there such crying going on or did they just try to keep their mind off of it.

 HF: Well there was some in some cases, and cases that they couldn’t help crying they

page_0056

AV inter. HF -17- 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

AV: Yeh, why do you think they call it a wake

HF: I think because people stay there practically all night, that’s why I think it was called a wake

AV: Where did you think that practice came from

HF: I wouldn’t have any idea, I don’t have any idea where it originated or, I don’t know. But little by little they’re getting away from it, if you don’t have a family then you’re usually setting there yourself (?) unless you have a lot of friends

AV: Who was that you were telling me this afternoon that this lady said when she was dead she didn’t want to spend a night alone

HF: Oh that was a lady from Freeland and she was a very good friend of the McNulty’s her and Mrs. McNulty were very close friends and she told her family that she wouldn’t want to be laid out in a funeral home because she doesn’t want to spend a night alone and of course she didn’t stop to realize that she wouldn’t know and when Bobby found out about it Bobby said she won’t have to spend the night alone because I’ll have the funeral home open all night long and the family or whoever wants to stay all night can stay all night long so she died if I’m not mistaken I think of a heart condition she wasn’t too old when she died and they have the fun eral home opened all night

AV: When did they start having them in funeral homes here

HF: Well around maybe earlier thatn 1950 my sister Mary died in 1953 and she was laid out at home there was some people that had them laid out in the funeral home even then but it was a little harder for people to get accustomed to it it just seemed as tho you didn’t care to have them at home but then the undertaker’s with all the conveniences that they had in a funeral home they would rather prepare the body in the mortuary there as he had everything right there he didn’t to go thru all that rigamarole that he’d have to do at home, didn’t have the means at home, because they must drain the blood from a person and naturally you don’t have that convenience

page_0057

AV inter. HF -18- 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

here, but at the funeral home they have that bathtub right there they have marble slab there because I was in the embalming room and that was before any of ours died, it was after Bobby had his place remodeled and his wife was in the hospital, no his wife was dead then I guess, no she was still alive she got sick after she had the place fixed up because she was scrubbin’ and all and she got a cold that did something to her lungs and that’s how she went, so she had me in the funeral home but she didn’t have me in the embalming room and then after she was in the hospital and her sister-in-law, Bobby’s sister she use to help with the bodies and she, I was goin’ up Center Street one day and she was at the door and she asked me to come on in and see the new funeral home, and I said I was in, Mary had me in, so I did see it but she said, I”ll bet you didn’t see it all, well I said, I saw the funeral parlor and she said, just come on in so I went in well this was the funeral parlor, there were 2 funeral parlors and as she was openin’ the door she said, this room we have the caskets, you pick out the caskets here and the next room is the embalming room and I said to her, Mary I don’t want to see the embalming room, and she said, why not there’s nothing to it you won’t see anything, and that embalming room gave me the creeps, when I had to go in to get death certificates after my mother died, after work and it was a rainy day, oh it was raining, it was gloomy and I wasn’t over the effects of it yet, and I had to go there for death certificates, well I came into the, I rang the door bell and nobody came and I rang the doorbell and novody came so I went to the barber shop right next door and said, do you have any idea if Bobby’s at home or not I rang the doorbell and there’s no answer and nobody came, and they said you go to the bottom of the steps he’s probably upstairs well in going to the bottom of the steps I had to pass right by the embalming room and I’m tellin’ you if that didn’t give me the creeps, I was drivin’ home from work after I got the death certif icates, I was drivin’ home and it was rainin’ so and I was down in the dumps and that embalming room really did something to me. Well all in all death in quite an

page_0058

AV inter HF -19- 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

experience one that I know that sooner or later I have to see it, I know that I couldn’t avoid it only if I died first but I was, I guess I am the only one of the family that was at every death, my sister Mary, well me and my Anna were there at the hospital when she died, then my mother well our Anna wasn’t here she wasn’t allowed to come she had a terrible nose bleed and she wasn’t allowed to come up but our little Anna came up so she was here at the time that my mother died and then the next one was my dad well we were in the kitchen here and he must have died while the priest was giving him the last rites of the church and the pleanary indulgence, and the other, when my brother Pete was in the hospital we and our Anna were there almost all day Saturday and Sunday and he died Monday morning and my brother John he was taken to the hospital early Sunday morning sometime after midnight and then Monday I took my sister-in-law over then Monday morning when Margaret called me and she told me, I was gettin’ ready to go to work and she called, and said, I just want you to know that my dad isn’t a bit good and just in case you get a call at work you’ll know what it’s all about so you can make your own decision are you going to go to work or aren’t you going to go, she said whatever you decide will be alright well after I hung up the receiver I thought if I go to work and my sister-in-law will get a call to go to the hospital she’d have no way of goin’ so I thought the best thing you can do is stay at home so I didn’t go to work me and my sister-in-law went over about 8 o’clock in the morning, I called Margaret and I said, well I don’t know what time she gets up I said you call her and tell her I’ll pick her up about 8 o’clock and we’ll go over to the hospital so we went over and we spent the entire day there until 5 o’clock and it was foggy and it was rainy it was in March around the end of March and Margaret came in, they put a special nurse on his case and Margaret was helpin’ out, she’s a trained nurse, and he got a little restless they put him in the oxygen tent and he fought that oxygen tent, and then we went out into the hall for awhile, I went out in the hall and my sister-in-law was sitting at the

page_0059

V inter. H F – 20 – 6/22/72

bed and Margaret came out to me and she said, I think you and my mother should go home, it’s getting foggy and it will be hard for you to drive home and there’s one thing I want to tell you, my dad will not last the night out, but don’t tell my mother, so then my sister-in-law came out in the hall and I said, Josephine I think we should go home, there’s nothing we can do there’s Margaret and that nurse is here and they’re takin’ care of everything and there’s nothing we can do and we might as well go home because it’s getting foggy and it’s gettin’ hard to drive, so we came home, but coming home, every now and then she would say to me, Pete’s going to get better isn’t he, and she could seem to see the seriousness of it she could only see that he was going to get better and I said, oh yes, he’s going to get better, and we’d drive along and nobody was sayin’ anything and she’d say, he’s going to get better, isn’t he, I said, oh yes, he’s going to get better, so then when I left her off and took the car up to the garage and I came in and I had a cup of coffee and I fed the dog and I let him out and I thought I’d better go down because if she got a call and she’s there all alone so I went down there again and I fixed my fire, and I went down, and I wasn’t down there too long when Margaret and her husband walked in and I knew what message they had because I could see that he was slippin’ although she didn’t see it, and Margaret said to her, well we thought it was better to come down and tell you personally rather than call you on the telephone, she said, daddy died at 5:30, so it seems that I had to be there before each one of them went, but for a little while he rallied and I thought things can’t be that bad, he brightened up so and I thought surely he’s goin’ get better and then suddenly you could see him failin’

AV: Did you have the wake at home or in the funeral home

HF: No in the funeral home

AV: Well why did they start having them in the funeral home

HF: In the first place I guess the undertaker would rather have it in the funeral home and then you did’t have the clutter at home you had more plrivacy and I really

page_0060

AV inter. H. F. -21 – 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

don’t know why they started, epecially people who were renting someone else’s home where here in town it was different because it was a company home but if you were renting a private home then maybe the landlord wouldn’t like it or sometimes the places were small and as time went on people were living in apartments and you couldn’t wake them in an apartment so little by little the majority of them had them waked in the funeral home anymore

AV: I wonder if it was because they were richer or more sophisticated

HF: Well even the ones that aren’t have them waked in the funeral home

AV: Even the Slovak, right. You said if they died it at home they undeertaker woul have to fix them up at home

HF: Well he use to bring all his stuff and and do the embalming at home

AV: Oh yeh, I thought they took them away and then brought them back

HF: Well not until later years, but if they died at home they didn’t usually take them out of the house unless they died in the hospital but they didn’t usually take them out of the house, he would bring all his stuff down and he would do the work at home

AV: Where

HF: Usually in the parlor that could be closed off, a room that could be closed off because, now when Pete’s little girl died and that was in Freeland the undertaker fixed her up at home

AV: How did she die

HF: She died of pneumonia I think, although she was supposed to have a leaking heart from the time she was born, but then the undertaker said it was pneumonia that she died from

AV: And they fixed her up home

HF: Uh huh

AV: And if they died in the mines they would take them to the undertaker

HF: Well in the beginning they woue bring them home

page_0061

AV inter. H. F. – 22 – Tape 13-[ ] 6/22/72

AV: Right away

HF: Uh huh and they undertaker would come, but they’d bring them home because I remember when there was one man that was killed on the breaker and he was boarding in Machelle’s and they brought him down to Machelle’s because he didn’t have a home here I guess his family or whoever he had was over Europe and he was boarding in Machelle’s and his brother was boarding there and they brought him there, I don’t remember where he was buried from that I don’t remember but I remember that they brought him home from the breaker

AV: How did he die

HF: He was caught by the wheels somehow, I guess a piece of his clothing was caught and before they were able to stop it he was badly mangled

AV: But now what would happen when they had an accident and they would be all smashed up like that, they’d embalm them at home still

HF: Uh huh, sometimes they embalming fluid wouldn’t stay in, my brother-in-laws case Bobby told our Anna that she woul have to have him buried right away on Saturday he was killed on Thursday and we could only wake him one day because the embalming fluid would not stay, he was so badly crushed that the embalming fluid wouldn’t stay in his body and he said, and if you insist in having a wake longer then he said there is nothing I can do about it, he said that is your wish but he said, the casket will have to be closed

AV: My goodness he’d start deteriorating already

HF: Uh huh, at that time in church they use to open the casket and from drivin’ from here to Freeland well naturally they body gets shaken up and you could already see that in church, you could see that the body wasn’t like it was at home

AV: Was there ever a time that you remember when they didn’t use the embalming fluid they used something else

HF: I don’t remember that

AV: I heard that they use to preserve them on ice at one point

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AV inter. H F – 23 – 6/22/72 Tape 13-2

HF: Well they do even now provided they had to hold the body for any length of time, even in the funeral home if somebody is away and, I thought that door was open it’s getter colder, if someone was away like it happened since the war when boys were away and if someone of their family died and they had to hold the body until he would come then they would have it at the funeral home and they would have it, now if it was in a room that was cold or whether they have them encased in ice I don’t know but they’d have them in the funeral home until this person would come

AV: Well I heard that they use to even preserve them wiouth embalming fluid just ice

HF: Maybe they did but I don’t remember that

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a. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha – 1 – 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

AV: Tell me about the problems they used to have with boarders.

HF: Well, with so many boarders, and everbody, the guy used to come around with the wagon with the beer and liquor. the boxes of beer were in the back of the wagon. the wagon was made something like, you know, those cars down there, no cover on it, and a seat there that a man used to sit on and drive the horses. Well, under this seat he would have the jugs of liquor, oh, big jugs. I believe we saw some of them down at the flea market Sunday, I was gonna call your attention to it, and then I didn’t. But we’ll go down to the flea market again, you’ll see the jugs down there. We used to have them for wine, and then when we quit makin’ it and we moved from there, I don’t know what we did with the jugs. they weren’t of value to anybody, so they probably were thrown out. they were earthenware, also. And, of course, the guy would come into the house, and if you wanted liquor, he would bring whatever kind of liquor you wanted. And I guess there was rye whiskey, and I don’t know what else Rye whiskey I know, but I don’t know what else. And he’d come in and he had a funnel and a measure, and he would pour it into this measure and then pour it with the funnel into the jug. Well all these men had a jug under their bed! That was the proper place to have it. And, of course, they used to go on their little sprees and the they’d start seein’, seein’ different kind of visions!

AV: Visions, eh!

HF: And jumpin’ out the widows and everything else!

AV: Really?

HF: Oh, yes, my dad says that he and.… they were boarding in one of these little houses, and there was only half a window in that room. Now people have built, you know, they put big windows in, but, like Mrs. Timko has a big window in her upstairs, but in those days it was just half of one of those windows. And he said, he and another man, they drank, but not that way. He said, we have a job. he said, after they would get drunk, I forget the name of the man, but he used to mention their names. Well then they’d start seeing different things, and they want to jump out the window So just the moment they would lay down, one of these guys would go on one of their sprees, and they’d have to hurry up and jump up from bed and try to hold him down. So, one day, they got one of the guys, he was halfway ou the window, and they got a hold of him and they put him back in – got hold of the back of his drawers and they pulled him back in! And he said one guy came downstairs and he had a wife and children in Europe, and he was chasin’ around with some woman here, and I think he had children with her. And he came down and he was standin’ at the stove and he was lookin’ into that fire, and he starts cryin’. And he said, what are you cryin’ about? Well, why shouldn’t I cry? Well, why are you cryin’, what are you, why are you cryin’? Don’t you see those little children burnin’ in the fire? (That’s why he’s cryin’.) Well, he says, we’re straining our eyes, we’re looking, we don’t see any, all we see if the hot coals, no children And he was imagining, I guess his conscience was bothering him. by what he was doing, so we was cryin’ that the children are burnin’ in that fire But they used to drink heavily. I guess that was the only way they could survive! It must have really been a picnic to have things like that happen. Already when we had the boarders that we had, I don’t remember too many of them. I know my brother-in-law boarded with us, ane Andrew Gaydos’s brother, John, boarded with us. He boarded until he got married. And then there was a man that then went out to the soft coal regions, out around Pittsburgh, and ended up in Duqaune[?]. He boarded with us, he’s the man that I used to teach. He’s dead now. And then there was another man that boarded, and from our place he left for Europe, and what-

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A Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -2- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

ever happened to him during the First World War I don’t know, because we never heard anything about him after he left. So they were the only…… oh, and I think, that man they used to call Big Andrew, I think he boarded with us for awhile. But they’re the only ones that I remember. but, like at Machella’s, my God, they had an array of boarders there!

AV: Did they

HF: And then when the peddlers would come around, peddlin’ different things, they were usually Arabian. and they would have these like suitcases, and they woud have dress material or shaving needs or shoelaces or pins and hairpins, anything that you needed, all these little things they’d have. Well, they use to, I don’t know how they’d come to town, did they come by train to Foundryville and then walk over here, or how they came in but then they couldn’t finish the town in one day, so they would ask for a night’s lodging. And there was one man that stayed at our place quite of number of times for overnight. Well, they used to stay in Machella’s also there was always room for one more!

AV: In Machella’s!

HF: If there was no room anywhere else, there was always room for one more in there! And we used to wait for those peddlers, well, not as much for those peddlers, becasuse after all they didn’t carry candy. And there was down at the Eckley store they had candy, but who’s gonna be running down at the store all the time? If you wanted candy, you’d go to Freeland, and you had to walk. Well, you weren’t inthe mood to walk all the time, everytime you wanted candy. So this man came around, and he was in a mine accident, and he had lost his sight, his face was all, like, marked with blue, and the coal, when this blast went off, the coal imbedded itself and he had blue marks left on his face. And he was completely blind, and he had some of the fingers off his hands. And he used to come with a big basket.…. and this was a big basket, not like that wicker basket there, it was made of different stuff, but it was a big basket with the handles on one side, and they had like a strap run across. there was a young boy that used to lead him around. And he would carry this old man would carry this basket, and the boy would hold him under the arm and lead him around. Well, when he’d come, he knew where the different things were in that basket, he could point them out to you. And we used to wait for him, because he always had candy. Different kind of candy, and we’d pick them out and buy them. And he had shoelaces, and he had any little thing that you needed, you know, those little things, and we used to wait for him. today, my God, the kids wouldn’t even want that candy.

AV: What kind did you have?

HF: Well, it was usually lollipops, or something that didn’t melt. Because, chocolate he couldn’t carry around, especially in the summertime, or it would melt! But as long as it was candy, it was good.

AV: So these were sort of overnight boarders?

HF: Yes, they used to come into town, and then till they would peddle the town they would stay overnight, and then you’d give them their breakfast or you’d give them a bite to eat whenever they would come in the evenings. And in the morning they would get up, and you’d give them breakfast before they would leave. Well, we used to deal with this one man, his name was Mr. Toveel[?], and my mother never wanted to get anything from him. She told him, she said, Nick[?] for the little bit that you ate, she said, many times you throw stuff out that you don’t eat, so she said I’m not going to charge you anything at all for it He was a very nice person. He had a son in Hazleton, I often see that name in the paper. And his son, I don’t know what Arabian

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -3- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

091 people are, but his son had turned a Catholic, and he married a girl from Hazleton. And the old man was around until he wasn’t able to get around any more. And then we had some later on that used to come around with a wagon and, horse and a wagon. they used to peddle.

 AV: What did they pay for their room and board?

HF: Nothing. They’d want to give you something for it, but even for one night that they slept, you didn’t charge anything. Then there were men, years ago, 096 whether they were legitimate or not, I don’t know, nobody every checked into it. But they would come around. and they ‘were, from people who had lived in Europe and are in this country, and somebody would write to them and tell them they’d want to build a new church in that particular town that they came from. Well, then they would come around from home to home, and ask for a donation toward the building of that church. Well, one night there was a man that was around like that, and it was dark already, and he asked for a night’s lodging. And, oh, I was workin’ then already, because we had our Rover. And he had my room, the back room upstairs. And I slept downstairs on the studio couch. And as you came down from the upstairs, if you turned to the right you went into the parlor, if you turned to your left you came into the kitchen, and to go out side. So some part of the night, this man needed to go out, and naturally in a strange house you get confused, and there was just a dim light. And it just seemed that the minute I heard someone come down the steps I was wide awake. And I sat up and I was listening. And the dog, it was a pretty big dog, I guess he stood about this high, and he was part hound, but he was a very af fectionate dog, and was layin’ at the couch. (That was Rover?) Rover. And he went over to the door, and when he saw this, because when the man come down the steps, I’ll say the man was confused. He was an elderaly man. And he went to turn into the parlor, and when he did the dog growled at him. And the dog stood his ground, he didn’t move, just growled at him. And I quick sat up and I said to him, What do you want? And he said, Oh, I made a mistake, I made a mistake, I want to go outside. And I told him he should turn the kitchen light on, and I said you’ll find your way around. But you know, I was a little bit scared when that happened, because, you don’t know the people, you don’t. I said it was a lot of nerve to take in a person. But noone ever thought of these muggings or killings, or anything, never! You could take someone in that you didn’t know anything about, and they would sleep in your house that night, but they never abused anybody, they never stole anything. You could go to sleep and sleep peacefully, and you knew that they weren’t gonna do anything.

 AV: Even with girls in the house?

HF: Yes, even with girls in the house. They never bothered. But like today, you’d be afraid to take someone in like that. Because you don’t know what they are. You don’t know what they can be accused of or anything. You don’t know wheth er they’re criminals or what they are. You’d actually be afraid to take them in. And how may times we had people like that stay in our place overnight. And then, naturally, whenever you’re sleeping, they can get around the house if they want to, but they never did. Never.

 AV: And, whose decision was it to take these people in?

HF: Well, they would ask my mother and my dad, and then the two of them would talk it over. And, well, for one night they would take them in, let them spend the night. Where are they gonna go? There wasn’t any bus service, there wasn’t any way of getting to Freeland or anything. So they used to let them stay overnight. And as I say, they never got into trouble. And in the morning, you would fix a little breakfast for them, and they would eat and they would be on their way.

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -4- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2 136

AV: Did the women of the house ever have any other trouble with boarders?

HF: No, not any, sometimes if a boarder got a little bit sassy, he’d be told off, and if he knew what was good for him, he’d keep his mouth shut, because he would be afraid to board anywhere else! And he had nowhere else to go, because they would board until they would find a girl that they would marry. And now, all they’re talking about is love, love, love! Well, I’ll bet anything that a lot of those men married not for love. They didn’t know the girls long enough. But, for convenience, because they didn’t have where to stay, they didn’t have anyone to take care of them. And this way, if they got married, and then housekeeping their own little place, they could do as they pleased, and they were taken care of. Because their meals were cooked for them, they were kept clean and everything. When I passed that remark off in my Anna’s when Eva was there, and I said they didn’t marry for love, I said, they married for con venience. And she said, Are you sure that’s all they married for? I said, well that’s all I know. So, I dropped the subject then, because I thought, I’m not going to get in deep with her. But I’ll always say that most of them married for convenience. A lot of them sent for girls that they knew in 151 Europe. And they would send for them, they’d send them money for a passport, and they’d bring them to this country and they would marry them here. Because my mother was coming from Europe when there was a young girl that was suppoed to come, she was to marry a man, and my mother got to New York, and, at 157 [Cas??le ???dens] where they used to, well, the immigrant oficials used to see that they’re all legitimate and everything, and when he asked my mother where she was going, she didn’t know the English language. All she would say, she is going to Eckley. And the man said to her, are you goin’ to Eckley, or are you goin’g to Heckley? He said, because there are two places, Eckley and Heckley. Well, then she didn’t know what it was, she just understood that it’s Eckley. And there was a man standing right near her, and then he asked her in our way, he said, Little girl, where are you going? Who are you going to? So my mother told him that she was going to her sister. And he said, what is your sister’s name? And she said Mary Stefan. And he said, Oh, you’re going to Eckley. He said, that’s where I’m from also. He came to meet the girl that was supposed to come. And she didn’t come that day, so then he, when he came into the house…Oh, no, this man, it wasn’t his girl that was comin’ over, but a man that was boarding in the house, I forget what the family’s name was…and, was it Gaspar, I don’t remember…and when he brought my mother over, well, my aunt was living there somewhere, but he brought my mother right into where he was boarding, and then had her taken over to my aunt’s place. And this man that was waiting for his girl to come from Europe, he was sleeping. And he came downstairs all thrilled, thinking that it’s his girlfriend that came! When he came down, he found out it wasn’t the girl friend! The girl friend came later. But that’s how they used to do it, they’d send for a girl in Europe, and she’d come here, and they’d get married, and then whereever he was boarding, well, they lost a border there, but they were 181 sure to get another one!

 AV: How did your mother meet your father?

HF: She came to America and she was staying with her sister, and I don’t know who my daddy was boarding with, and that’s how they met. You know, they would all, I guess the whole bunch would get together, because they were all from Europe. And maybe they weren’t from the same town, but they would be from towns that weren’t too far away, and I guess the thing that would bring them together was the idea that they were all from Europe, and they’d have plenty to talk about.

 AV: So she wasn’t sent for.

HF: No, no. She came to America because she didn’t have anybody in Europe. She

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -5- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

had an aunt, but her parents had died when she was small. She didn’t remeber either one of her parents. She was raised by her aunt. So then, she had enough money to get a passport and come to America. She came here to her sister. And then, she met my dad, I don’t know how long she was here in America. And they got married. they were married in Hazleton because there wasn’t any Roman Catholic church in Freeland. there was St. Mary’s, but at that time the church ruling is, if a Byzantine/rite is marrying a Latin rite, they have to be married in the fellow’s rite. If he is Roman Catholic, then they still have to marry in the Roman Catholic rite. If the two of them are Roman Catholic, then they can marry in either one of the churches, his church or her church, if they belong to churches in different towns. then they can marry in either one. But with the Byzantine, rite, you have to follow the man. At the one time, you followed the girl. So they had to go to Hazleton. And as I said, I used to hear them talking. They had to walk, they and two witnesses, I don’t know who their witnesses were – it may be on their marriage certificate, for all I know – they walked to Foundryville, they got the train at Foundryville, they went to Hazleton, they went to St Joseph’s Church in Hazleton, they were married there, and after they were married, they walked down to the train again, got the train and rode to Foundryville, and walked from Foundryville home! And they didn’t go on a honeymoon!

AV: I guess it wasn’t the custom at the time to go on a honeymoon.

HF: No, naturally it wasn’t. Oh, it wasn’t the custom for ages. Well, when Anna was married it still wasn’t the custom to go on honeymoons Now, even though you have to loan them money, they go on honeymoons. Even tho they don’t have their own money, they’ll loan money from the bank and go on a honeymoon.

AV: So at that time they used to get married and set up their house right away?

HF: Yes. Sometimes they’d have to board wherever they were until they got themselves all set up. But there were a lot of homes here, and they could get a home easily because naturally they kept it for their workers. The company had the homes, because the town was big here, and there was what they called Number Four, but I don’t remember the homes that were down there. Although I did her my mother talk about them.

AV: What was Number Four?

HF: That was down back of the church. There was part of the town down there. See, they used to build their homes where there were workings. And there was a slope down there, and there was a breaker down there. And they tried to build the homes, that the men would be close to the working. that’s how they used to build their homes. And then down at Number Seven, there were workings down there, there was a boiler house down there, there wer homes down there.

AV: How may homes at these places?

HF: I don’t know how many were in Number Four, and I don’t know how many were in Number Seven, because in Number Seven all I saw was the foundations. We used to take a walk out when I was just a kid, with my mother and dad on a Sunday afternoon. We used to take a walk out and we used to go down through the woods and we’d pick teaberries, and then in the fall of the year we used to go for chestnuts. And we went down through Number Seven there, and I was these foundations and I asked about them. And my dad and mother said, well, she said, these were homes. People used to live here. And I said, in the woods like this? And my dad said, that wasn’t all woods when peope lived here. And he showed me the home where the Maloney family lived, that was Margaret Maloney’s grandparents. Margaret lives down near Mary Zurko now. that was her grandparents. They lived in that home, and there were a number

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A Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -6- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

237 of other familes that lived in that section. But they, the company, built their homes wherever there were workings. And then their miners were close to their workings, they didn’t have to travel. So that’s how the town was set up. It wasn’t zoned, it wasn’t all laid out like they’re doing now, they’re building Model Cities, and you can’t build here because it’s a business section and you can’t build there because it’s a recreation section, and all that. In those days they didn’t do that. They just built the homes where 245 the workings were, so the men would be close to the workings.

AV: Well now, you say that these boarders were looking just for a marriage of convenience to take care of them.…

HF: Well that’s when I thought, because, how are you going to fall in love, when you meet a person and know them about two or three days, are you gonna fall in love them them?

AV: Oh, that quick they married?

HF: They used to marry quite soon. Because they, they, who wants to keep boarding if they could get a place of their own? And, the girls that used to come here, they would have to do housework because there was nothing else to do, and there were women here in town that had a good bit of boarders, they would have a girl working for them. But how much did the girl get? Today it’s not even pocket money. Well, I don’t really know, but I know it was very little. Very little. Even girls that went out of town to work, there was a boarding house at Jeddo, and girls from Eckley here used to work at the boarding house. They were paid very low wages, very low wages.

AV: Was there a boarding house at Eckley?

HF: They said that there was a boarding house at Eckley. But not that I remember. They only place that I remembered was the home down by the store. It was in around where John Fatula lives, down there. There wa a big home there, and when I remember it, it was four families were living in that place.

AV: What did it look like?

HF: Oh, it was a big home. It had a big basement that you could even live down in the basement And then they had the first floor and they had the second floor, and they had an attic, and they were big rooms. So now whether that would have been a hotel, I don’t know, And, but then when I remember it, there were families living there, it was the No[???] family was living there, 269 Andrew Gaydos’s brother was living on one side, and Mr. [?????] was living in the one side and Agnes Zahay was living in one side, and then I don’t know whether that would have been a hotel, I don’t know what it was. Or, a boarding house, I don’t know what it was. but it was a big building. and when they started ripping up the town, they tore that down.

AV: So the girls that came over from Europe.…

HF: they used to go out and do housework for, anywhere that they could get, like in Freeland if there were Jewish families that had businesses, they used to go in and do housework for them. And that’s they way they would support themselves. So, when they had a chance to marry, they married because then they wouldn’t have to get out to work.

AV: These girls that came over, they didn’t stay with their parents, they stayed with.….

HF: No, their parents would be in Europe. And they’d come over themselves.

AV: Alone? Was that permitted?

HF: Sure. Oh, yes, that was permitted in those days. Because there were a lot 279 of single men coming over here, too. I understand that the coal companies used to have agents that went through these towns in Europe looking for workers And naturally the company woud like to have the men marry and settle down. So a lot of single girls came to this country. Their parents

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -7- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

283 were in Europe, they’d come over to this country. AV: Didn’t their parents mind?

HF: No, no they didn’t mind (she leaves the microphone)… they’d have to learn to take care of themselves. They couldn’t depend [????] their parents all the time, and that’s how a lot of those things happened, that they would – and the immigration officials were not too particular on account of knowing that, well the country was just growing. And they didn’t care as long as a person was healthy, then you could come.

AV: So the parents gave permission for their daughters to go, really trusting them then?

HF: Naturally.

AV: And you mentioned that your sister married one of your boarders. Did the 293 parents mind if that happened?

HF: Well, my dad didn’t say anything, and my mother didn’t say anything. He seemed to be a nice person, and my dad didn’t like the idea too well that she was so young. Because she was just sixteen in January, and married in April. And my dad thought that she could have waited longer. But she married. And she had a good life with him. She was, after, let’s see, Pete was her first child, then she had a dead-born child, and then she had Helen. Well, I think not until after she had Helen, I guess, that she got typhoid. Yes, she got 305 typhoid after she had Helen. And that’s when she got this phlebitis. But the doctors didn’t know at that time what phlebitis was. And it wasn’t taken care of the way it should be. Because now with phlebitis they won’t let you walk, and then your legs are bandaged right away, and the doctor says that can happen – well, they used to call it a milk leg, but they said that doesn’t only happen when a women has a child, that can happen after an operation. And it’s all the veins that do that, and he said it can happen after typhoid fever and after confinement. So she wasn’t even out of bed when she got this phlebitis, and then on top of that she get typhoid fever. Now where she got typhoid fever, nobody knows. They checked the water supply right away. But no one else in town got typhoid, with the exception of her and our Anna. And then there was one fellow that was living down in the valley, he got typhoid. They were the only three that we knew of in this vicinity that got typhoid. Well, when our Anna was taking care of Mary, and Helen was just a baby, she was nursing. So, they found that Helen had traces of typhoid. She had a terrible diarrhea. Well, then, Mary had to give up nursing her, because they felt that she was getting typhoid from her. Annie took care of the baby, she took care of Mary, and Miss Smith was the nurse. She made a basin of water with some disinfectant in the water. And every time that our Anna woud go up to the bedroom, she would have to wash her hands in this water. But, one day Miss Smith came in, and – she used to come in four and five times a day to check on Mary – she come in one day, and our Anna wasn’t feeling good. She said, Anna, you’re sick. Oh, I only have a little headache. And she said, Anna, you’d better go home and go right to bed. I only have a little headache I have this to do, I have that to do. So, all right, Miss Smith left, she went back home. She lived down in that house where Emil Gera is living now. And she comes up later, and our Anna is still there. And she said, Anna, I said you should go home, you’re sick. She said, you go home now, and I’m calling Doc Trigonmiller. And he’s gonna come down and check on you. So, we already had gone to bed – there weren’t any televisions, there weren’t any radios, so there wasn’t anything to keep you up at night. You went to bed. If you weren’t either crocheting or doing something like that, you went to sleep. And then, another thing, but I guess then already we had electric lights. But at the time that you just had lamps, well you wouldn’t be sitting

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -8- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

340 alongside of that lamp all night, like they do now. And I used to sleep with our Anna. We were in bed already, and there was a knock on the door, and my daddy went down to the door, and of course he wouldn’t open the door unless he asked who was there. If he couldn’t recognize who was there, he wouldn’t 345 open the door for them. So Doc [Tu????miller] said, Oh, John, it’s only me. Well, my dad opened the door for him, and he said, Well, no one sent for you. What are you doing down here? And you didn’t have to pay charges whenever they’d come down like that. You paid fifty cents a month and you were covered. You didn’t pay no eight dollars or ten dollars because he made a night visit. And he said, I came to check on Anna. Miss Smith called me and told me Anna was sick. And you know, we have to worry about that typhoid. So he comes upstairs and he sees that I am in bed with our Anna, and he said to me, You get out! Out! You daren’t stay in bed with her, because we don’t know what she has. Well, a kid like that, I never had to go to the doctor or any thing. My god, I had to get up, and I wasn’t dressed in a nightgown, I was [handwritten in the right hand column illness] in a slip. And I said, do I have to get out, right in front of him here? And I said, well I’ll get out when you leave. I said you get out right now, and don’t you come back either, until we find out! So, like it or not, I had to get out of bed. And he took a sample of blood, and he said he was going to send it in to the laboratory and let her know the next day. The next day he comes down and he said Anna, I’m sorry, you have typhoid. You can’t go down to Mary’s. And our Anna was very sick for awhile. And that’s where she got that phlebitis, from typhoid. Anna wasn’t taken care of, even though she doctored with different ones. None of them knew about it. That’s how she gets that open ulcer on her leg now, because that’s all from those veins 367 breaking down.

AV: So, in those days, when these men were looking for a wife, what did they look for in a girl?

HF: A good worker. One that didn’t shirk her work, that would work! That would raise a family. That’s what they were looking for, most of all. And that she’d know how to cook in one way or another. They knew right well that she wouldn’t know how to cook just then, because none of them did. When they came from Europe they didn’t have to do that over there, or they didn’t have the methods that they had here. My Mother had to learn, and my aunt – my dad often said that my aunt was a very good bread baker. But he said, you know, he said, that she would not teach your mother how to bake bread. Your mother had to struggle along, and he said how manytimes we had to throw that dough out. But he said, that’s the way she learned. And then Mrs. McGilll was [?78] living here in town. At that time she was an old woman – whom I knew her al ready she was an old woman. But she was willing to help anyone. And she helped my mother along a lot. Because she didn’t know anything about starch ing, and the men used to wear these fancy shirt fronts, and the shirt fronts had to be starched. Well, my mother didn’t know anything about starching. Mrs. McGill taught her. And there were a lot of other things that Mrs. McGill [handwritten in the right hand column Irish helping Slavs] taught her. So they had to learn. And in the line of cooking, until they really learned how to do it, I guess many times they spoiled something. That’s the only way they were gonna learn.

AV: How could they tell if they were good workers, or good cooks?

HF: Oh, I don’t know how they could tell, but any way, that’s what they were looking for, women who would work – there was a lot of work to be done.

AV: How did the women choose and decide whether she wanted the man?

HF: Well, that I wouldn’t know. Did they just settle for a home, they wouldn’t have to go out and do housework for someone. And a lot of the marriages turned out very successful. Sure, there were a lot of marriages. Today when girls

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -9- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

know fellows for years, they’re engaged and they’re going together for years, and their marriage turns out a flop. And of course these women didn’t have any choice, after they had a few children, there was a family to raise. Wel, even though you didn’t have everything the way you wanted, you still stuck. Because there was a family to raise, and how were you going to raise them? There wasn’t any relief, no relief! So you had to raise your children on your own. And I think that’s what kept them together a lot. And then, they were starting up the churches, and they didn’t have a lot of this silliness like some of the priests have today, they’re teaching what they shouldn’t teach, but everyone had a deep faith in God. And they felt that as long as they had faith in him, they would get along. And they did. Not that they didn’t have their little spats, mind. It wasn’t all honey, but they got along. Because I know my mother and dad had spats many times. Many times. But my mother just stayed. She’d keep her mouth shut. I told her one day, I said, I wouldn’t keep mine shut, I’dtell him what I think! And she said, oh, it’s not going to do any good. So she’d keep quite. And he’d fuse a little bit – because he was quick-tempered – but he could get over it real fast. And then he’d be sorry for what he said. But it was already said. Well, if he didn’t leave me anything else, he left me his temper! Yes, he left me his temper!

AV: What did they consider a good age for a girl to get married?

HF: Oh, at that time they married early. They married early. I should think that some of those girls would be in their fifteens, when they would marry, because an awful lot of them married very early. Somehow, they managed to get along, they mannaged to raise a family, they kept house, well, of course they were used to hard work. Because, from the time we were kids, we had to help out, whether it was in the garden, or when, on Saturdays when we didn’t have school you’d go up in the slate banks and sit up there all day, picking coal. Today, the kids get an express wagon to play, for fun. We got it for work, we didn’t get it for fun. But, you never griped, there were so many of us picking coal, well, you’d try to beat the next one. How many buckets did you pick today? You were trying to beat the next guy, picking coal. And then, when huckleberries were ripe, you were in the woods. And you couldn’t say No, you’re not goin’. You were goin’, whether you like it ornot. I wanted to go to the one afternoon. I didn’t get there! My mother told me, you don’t have a can full – because I wanted to leave early. And I told her, and she says wellI don’t have my can full. And I said well I’d like to go to see that picture. Well she said I couldn’t go with an empty can. So, I didn’t see the picture! And I didn’t open my big mouth at her, either. I kept quite. I knew it didn’t do any good. I kept quite. And I’m still alive – I didn’t see that picture, but I’m living. I’m not any the worse off! And in the fall of the year, you go for leaves. Well, that I liked. Oh, I still love to go for leaves. You’ve no idea how nice they smell! You know, when the leaves are dry, and you’re walking through those leaves, and they’re rusting around your feet, and they smell so nice. You had burlap bags. You could buy them, because, you’d buy chop for the cow, and it came in burlap bags. You’d save those bags. So you’d take those bags, and you’d take long pieces of either clothing or a piece of rope, and leaves are light. You’d stuff the bags as full as you could stuff it. And then you’d have maybe four or five bags that you’d have tied onto this express wagon with a rope, so they wouldn’t fall off. You’d bring them home, and then that was, they used to put that under the cow, as a layer, that she didn’t have to lay on the bare floor. And in the wintertime that’s what the cow used to lay on. And then when they were cleaning the stable out – as you had to clean the stable out every couple of days if you wanted to keep it clean – well then all that went out on what you

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -10- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

would call the manure pile. That used to be used on the garden for fertilizer. And it’s better than any fertilizer in the world.

AV: That was only for cows, you used the leaves?

HF: Even for under pigs, so that they wouldn’t have to lay on the bare floor. And then you’d used some straw. But you made sure they weren’t on the bare floor. And even though the people weren’t educated, but most of them knew how to take care of animals. So that was our job there, we used to go down to Number Eight, down where I showed you that I though was the Number Eight slope. Well, down in that section – it’s all stripped now – we used to down in that section. And the leaves would really be high. There were a lot of trees and they’d fall off, so they’d really be high. And, I used to enjoy walking through them, and they used to smell so good!

AV: So, the kids were really brought up with work.

HF: Yessir, they were brought up with work. No mini-bikes trying to shatter your nerves! As soon as they have a couple of pennies, they go out and buy a mini-bike and they runit like mad! No sir, you didn’t see the kids do that!

AV: So the girls at that age were almost ready for marriage?

HF: Yes, when, I think when they were fourteen, fifteen they were ready for marriage.

AV: Why did your father object to your sister’s marrying so young?

HF: Oh, he didn’t exactly object, only he told her to be careful, that she is so young. But girls didn’t get out like they do today, you know, to travel around and meet different men. You didn’t get out that way, so a man that you knew and you thought you liked, you married, and that was it, you were settled.

AV: What kind of standards did the girl have in looking, and choosing a man? Did she avoid certain characteristics?

HF: Well, I think most of them out try to avoid men who drank heavily. And men who were good-natured, good workers. Because even then there were men among them that would work a few days a week and take the rest of the time off. They didn’t want to work. Well, then, you were trying to be careful not to marry someone like that, because then you were in trouble.

AV: How would you know?

HF: Well, even in the one town, a small town like this, naturally you’d know about one another no matter how it is. People talk, and there’s nothing very secret. Everything is told, and especially women knew something about a man and they knew that, say, for instance, your daughter was going to be married and I knew something about this man that wasn’t too nice, well, I wouldn’t keep it under my hat, I’d tell her about it.

AV: You’d tell the bride, or?

HF: The mother, and tell the mother that thell her daughter to be careful.

AV: Ah, hah!

HF: Oh, yes, we didn’t even need a telephone in this town!

AV: I believe it!

HF: But everyone got along, regardless of what you were, were you Dutch, were you Irish, were you Polish, were you Tyrolean, it didn’t matter. Everyone got along with one another. Everyone was good enough for anybody.

AV: Did they object to marriages between, like, Slavish and Irish?

HF: No, not, ah, they had some objection to it, but not that much. If the girl insisted, then they went ahead and they married.

AV: Which ones might they object to?

HF: Well, really, I think the most they would object to is someone who was lazy, and someone who drank too much. They’d object to that, because they would just figure that she wouldn’t have a good life. And it was true that a lot

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A. Varensano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -11- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

of girls got married, but they married American-born fellows, not foreigners. American-born fellows. And they had a terrible life with them. They drank too heavily. There’s one in particular that I know, that, God, the poor soul got a beating on her wedding night. The bridesmaids all sitting in the room, and he came upstairs with something – our Mary was one of the bridesmaids, my sister Mary was one of the bridesmaids – and, I don’t know, he had a couple drinks, well, maybe more than a couple. Well, they used to have big weddings. It wasn’t anything fancy, it wasn’t platter and all these fancy-dressed meats and everything, it was, no wedding cake, it was cookies, you had cookies on the table. And, he came into the room, I don’t know for what, but the bridesmaids were all sitting there, and she said something to him and she had her face slapped. Right on her wedding day. She didn’t leave him, though. Today, if a fellow did that, that would be the last he saw of her. She’d leave him. And she had a very miserable life for years. He drank heavily, and he believed in a wife being a servant, and she had her children quite close. She raised a nice family with her sister, and I used to go to her house. And we used to walk home from church. Well, I guess on his way home he would visit every saloon that is around. By the time he got home, he was pretty well loaded, and when he’d get home, he’d start hollering for no reason at all. And if she answered, then she got it. So one Sunday afternoon, my neighbor saved her. He was chasing her down the alley, and there were, the Banks were down at the end of the street, and the neighbor stepped out and he stopped. He waited until he knew that she was far enough away that he wouldn’t get her. So that kind of life you had. But, tell that to the kids today, they’s say, You don’t know what you’re talking about. That could never happen here, never. It happened.

AV: What kind of courtship did they have? Was there a customery walk, or something?’

HF: They used to go out for a little walk, but there ws no, well then in later years when they had picnics, well they would meet the girls at the picnics or they would take them to the picnic. But there wasn’t this going out for drives and all that stuff. That didn’t go on. After a little while the fellow would ask the girl to marry him and she would. Especially if she didn’t have any parents here. Because she had to look out for herself.

AV: Did they meet at certain places or talk together in the living room, or something?

HF: Well, I doubt they really came into one another’s homes that way. They usually stayed out, and take a walk around, and she’d go home. Because, even when I already was working, and there wasn’t ???, well, where are you gonna walk, to Freeland, and then be coming home at all hours of the night. So we used to stay in town, and it just

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -12- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

now, you’d walk, that was the road that they used to go up to the colliery with. There was no name for it. And they you’d start walking up the Main Street. As you were walking up, maybe there was a couple couples coming down Main Street and then they’d go up Back Street! And, well, “Hello”, “Hello”! I can’t tell you have many rounds you’d make around the town, because around here it was an alley, where the street is now, that was an alley. And you’d walk up that way, and you’d start going down the Back Street again. And the couples that you’d met, you met them I dont’ know how many times a night, and every time, “Hello”, “Hello”!

AV: How late would you do this?

HF: Oh, we were supposed to be in the house by nine o’clock or a little after nine, and then if you would go out later you had to give an account of yourself. Today, my God, if you told the kids to do that, they’d think you’re crazy! And one night we were out – our mother and dad were out to a wake – and, oh, it was a beautiful moonlight night, and me and our Anna were out, and wer eout later than we could otherwise be, and we’re comin’ home, and we had that small window in the back room, and we used to keep a screen in there, but I guess the screen was taken out, the window was open, so, the curtains were short curtains, but they were blowing out the window. We’re coming down the street, and we can see this, and we though, our daddy is waiting for us to come home, sitting at the window. So we came down to the house, and I didn’t want to try the door, our Anna didn’t want to try to door. But my mother used to leave the door open for us to come in. And we’d close the door after – well, usually my dad would come in after we came in the house and he would close up the door for the night. So I said to our Anna, Somebody’s sitting at that window! And the curtains were blowing out, there must have been another window open in the place, and there was a draft and the curtains were blowing out. So we come to the house, and we are afraid to try the door. We’re sitting around outside. We finally came to the conclusion, it doesn’t help to sit outside. No matter how early we came down, and we’re gonna sit outside, we’re gonna be out there late. So then they won’t believe us that we came home at that time. They’ll think we just came home when we rap at the door. We finally tried the door and the door was locked. And I said, well, I guess they are waiting for us. So we tried the door again, because I said to Anna, I said, You know, Anna, the longer we stay here, the later it’s gonna get, they aren’t gonna believe that we were here so long, they’ll think we just came home. And we tried the door again. My mother heard us. And she said give my daddy a nudge and she said, did you lock that door? And see, it was my mother’s job to fix things up for the night. My daddy never did, so he wasn’t used to it. And she said, Did you lock that door? And he said, I don’t know. And it was just a habit for him to slip the latch. She says, I hear somebody. And she said, I wonder if the girls are home? My daddy gets out of bed, looks in the back room, we weren’t there. So, he came down, and he opened the door, and of course we though we were going to get a ripping out, because it was late already. Well, late in those days, today it wouldn’t be. Today maybe they wouldn’t be going out yet. And he said, how long were you girls out here. ANd we told him how long, and we were afraid to rap at the door. Well, he said, I was down, and when I was down, it just slipped my mind and I just slipped the latch and that’s it. You weren’t being watched!

AV: You mean, they would go in bed and trust you to come home?

HF: Oh yes, an order was an order. You were told what time you were expected home and you, there were very few that disobeyed that order, very few. Because, you didn’t question them on it. They gave you an order, you didn’t

page_0077

A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -13- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

say anything about, well, why should I, or anything of that sort. You didn’t say anything, you made sure that you were going to try to be home at that time. If you weren’t, you had to have a good explaination of why you weren’t.

AV: They would be in bed already?

HF: Oh, yes, they would go to bed. And like that night, my dad had to come down and open the door for us.

AV: How much older then the girls were these boys that were starting to court?

 HF: Oh, they’d be old enough to be working. They didn’t get married unless they’d be working.

 AV: Unless they were full-fledged miners, or?

 HF: Well, I don’t know, I would say the men, the men usually were in around twenty or twenty-one when they’d marry.

 AV: Would they be married if they were miner’s laboreres, instead of full-fledged miners?

 HF: Oh, yes. Oh, sometimes they worked for years before they’d be, before they’d get a promotion to something else. My brother-in-law was married and he was still driving a mules. He wasn’t a miner, he was still driving mules, then from that he went on to being a laborer, and from that he got to be a miner.

 AV: So advancement to the position of miner requires not only training as a laborer but a position…

 HF: Oh, you couldn’t be a miner unless you passed an examination. You had to get a miner’s certificate. You had to go to a board, and you were asked questions you had to pass your miner’s test. Then you would get a certificate if you passed the test you got a certificate, and if you didn’t pass the test, then you couldn’t mine until you took another test. Until you would pass it. And.

 AV: WHen they’d pass this test and get a certificate, were they automatically assigned a miner’s jon?

 HF: When they asked for a job as a miner, well, if there was an opening, he would get a job as a miner. If there wasn’t any opening, then he would have to wait his turn.

 AV: And still work as a laborer.

 HF: Yeah.

 AV: Oh, what about the woman’s role in getting some more food for the house? How would she feed the family?

 HF: Well, there were grocers that came into town. You didn’t have to go out of town to buy anything. Like now, if you need a loaf of bread, you don’t have it at home, you have to run to Freeland to get it, because nobody comes into town with the exception of that baker on a Monday morning, and on Friday. But if durin gthe week you would run out of something, you didn’t run to Freeland to get it, there was a baker came into town, there were grocers came into town, they’d come in one day, and they would ask you what you had to order. Well, you told hom what all you wanted to order, he would mark it into an order book. The next day he would deliver it for you.

 AV: Was this when you were small, too?

 HF: Oh, that went on till I was, I guess I was out of school. Because when those wagons stopped coming here, they came in what they called a store on wheels. Then they didn’t take your order, but they used to come in every day. You walked through it, they had shelves in there, they had everything displayed just like they do in a store. You would pick out whatever you wanted.

 AV: What about huckleberry picking? When did you start that?

 HF: Oh, we started that when we were just kids. About seven. We were going to school, and I think when you were going to school already, then you were old enough to go for berries.

 AV: Oh, yeah!

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -14- 6/15/72 Tape 14-2

HF: Oh, yes! When the mother was going for them, you were going. You didn’t say no. They didn’t know what no was. If you said no, they didn’t know what it was. At least they let on they didn’t. Because you still had to go, whether you liked it or whether you didn’t. After you got out to the woods, if you loafed, all right, but if you didn’t have your can full when they were ready to leave for home, then you really had to hurry to get your can filled!

 AV: You didn’t eat the huckleberries!

 HF: Oh, yes, yes, we used to eat huckleberries. But we tried not to, because if you did start eating berries, then, well, you were hungry for them, and instead of putting them in the can, you’d put them in your mouth. And that didn’t pay, because you couldn’t sell them! And you were out there because you had to help out the family. It wasn’t that you went out there, and whatever you picked and sold, that was for you. That went into the family kitty. Whatever was needed then, it was bought. You bought whatever…if you didn’t need anything, you didn’t get it. If you needed something, you got it.

 AV: How much could a kid bring back?

 HF: Oh, some of the kids were good pickers. They could bring back as high as five quarts, i fthey were good pickers and there was a good spot to pick.

 AV: Did little boys go out, too?

 HF: Oh, yes. Boys and girls, made no difference.

 AV: The mother went with them?

 HF: Um-hmm.

 AV: When were the kids allowed to go alone?

 HF: Well, if they knew their way around the woods, you know, if they knew how to get out. All right getting into the woods, but if you don’t lose your bearings when you are ready to get out. So you really knew how to get around.

 AV: When was the first time you went out alone?

 HF: I never went alone, never. I’d be afraid. I never went alone. I alwasys went with, if our Anna was going with someone, or Mrs. Dragonosky was going, I used to go with them. But I never went out to the woods alone. In the first place, I’d lose my bearings. I can lose sense of direction right away. And I could be going the opposite direction instead of coming out. Then I would lose myself, and there wouldn’t be anyone to make a tape for you!

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Angela Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -1- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

AV: Tell me about the woman’s role in the mining town.

 HF: Well, the women raised their families and took care of thier boarders, cooked on coal stoves, took a long time to cook! Washed clothes on a washboard, do I have to say how many tubs they had to go through?

 AV: Sure!

 HF: Well, they washed the clothes out in the first tub, put in the second tub, poured hot water over it, an dthen washed clothes out of hte second tub, put them in a boiler, and chipped some soap into the boiler, added water, put it on the stove, let it boil. And after they’d boil a while – that is, the white clothes – then they would take the boiler off and put the clothes into a tub of cold water, and not rub them any more, just slosh them around in the cold water, and then put them into the rinsing water. And there they would rinse them out, and whatever…In the beginning they didn’t have any wringers at all, they had to wring all of their clothes out by hand. Later on, they got the wringers that were attached to a tub. And it was so much easier, because all the, like the sheets and the big things were hard to wring out. Even the children wore long underwear, and it was all that feece-lined underwear, and that was heavy. But they still wrung out with their hand untilthey got the wringers. Then they put them through the wringers. So, washing clothes was an all-day job, you’d start in the morning, didn’t finish until the evening! And, then they had to do all the work that was necessary in the house, all the cleaning. No carpets, no linoleum. The floor was scrubbed. And, with about ten or twelve boarders in the house, pretty hard to keep them clean. But they did. And then, in the summertime, when berries were out, regardless of how much work they had at home, they still went out for berries, picked berries. Because that was an income for them. The men weren’t making much – a dollar for ten hours.

 AV: Who would do their hoursework when they went out for berries?

 HF: They would do their housework before they would go out. And then, they didn’t have all the fancy furniture and all that to take care of. Everything was plain, as I told you. They didn’t have, when there were so many boarders, or even, we didn’t have that many boarders because we only had that I remember two or three at a time, but there were people who had, like Mrs. Machella my God, she had a load of boarders. If anyone came from across, and came looking for work, the boss would send them down to Machella, because they said they can’t get board anywhere. Well, they sent ’em down there, and they knew that, regardless of how, she would take them in. And nobody was fussy about their food, there wasn’t a lot of fancy food. She’d usually make a pot of sauerkraut and put pieces of pork in it, and potatoes, and that was the meal. There was no fussin’ around with fancy foods and salads and all that cooked stuff, none of that. Everything was plain, rather. And they didn’t have chairs to go around the table. Even the tables were home made. (Yes?) Oh, yes indeed they were home made. In later years, then, people started buying bought tables, but a lot of the tables, they were real long, and they were just home made, anything that they could serve their meals on. And then, instead of chairs, they had benches. They would put long benches, if the table was long, or either put two benches on a side, and that’s what they did, they didn’t have chairs.

 AV: Who made these benches?

 HF: The men themselves.

 AV: The boarders?

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -2- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

HF: Well, either the man of the house, or if the boarders understood how to do those things, they did. But if they didn’t, well, then, the man of the house, if he understood how to do a little of hammering and sawing, they weren’t anything fancy. Because you can see that one that I have in the shanty, that’s on of those benches. I can remember that way, way, way back. And the bigger one that we had, a longer one, well that one broke. It was so worn out that it finally gave in. So when we were movin’ from the Back Street down to this street, we didn’t even take it. We left it up there. It wasn’t worth takin’ down here. And…

 AV: This one here was made by your father?

 HF: I think it was made by one of the boarders. My dad wasn’t very handy with tools. If there was something that had to be fixed, he would fix it, but he was never very handy with tools. After my brother John was old enough, he understood more about it, my dad didn’t, even in later years if he had to fix something, it goes to such a rigamarole before he’d get everything assembled, and then, a chewin’ tobacco had to be first, before he could assemble anything, no matter when he was gonna do someting, whether it was goin’ out in the garden, no matter what he was gonna do, he would take time out to put a chew of tobacco in. My mother always said, well you can’t even think without the cew of tobacco in your mouth! And he always chewed tobacco, always. So, then, every piece of clothes wasn’t ironed, as long as they were washed, they were clean. They weren’t ironed. And then the men, all their working clothes, there was no laundries around, like just a number of years ago, before all the mines closed, there was a laundry in Freeland, the men could take their working clothes there, and they were washed for them, and they were mended…

 AV: Who did that?

 HF: Olan Overlander had the laundry over in Freeland. The laundry is still there. I don’t know whether it is still in operation or not, but it’s still there, right above that bridge, you know, when we go under that old road, well, right above that bridge. He used to be one of the partners in the overall factory, and then after John died, then they dissolved that partnership and they sold out to Mr. Abrams. So that’s when he started up this laundry, and he had a lot of work there, but then, as everyone else, as he was growing older, his health was beginning to fail, and he got to the point where he couldn’t very well remember. But I saw him not too long ago, and he looked very well, and I talked to him some time in the winter. I met him on Center Street, and I talked to him for quite a while, and he looks a lot better than he did. For a while there, they were afraid to let him drive his truck or anything because his memory was so bad, but it seems that he has improved. But he used to do the laundry, and if there was any mending to be done, he had a sewing machine right there in the laundry, because I was coming home early from work one day, and I hadda stop at Griffith’s lumberyard for something, and this laundry is right across the road, and Olan came out, and he asked me to go into see, you know, how it is worked, and he had me sit down to one of the sewing machines that he has there, the sewing machines we have, and he did all the mending, and then they would deliver the clothes home for the miner. So they didn’t have to wash their clothes, but even in my mother’s time when my dad worked, she did all of his wash, all of his clothes were washed overalls, usually, well, on the washboard. You couldn’t take them and rub them like you did the other clothes. You would spread the overalls out, you’d have the washboard in the tub, and the water, a little bit of water in there, and you would take and you’d spread the overalls on the washboard, and you’d rub them with soap, and then with a scrub-

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -3- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

brush…

 AV: What kind of soap?

 HF: Always yellow soap. We used to use Fels-Naphtha most of the time. Then there was another bar of yellow soap, I don’t remember now what the name of it was, but we usually used Fels-Naphtha, because that had got a bit of naphtha in it, and we thought it cleaned much better. And with a scrub brush, not one of these coarse brushes, it was more on the softer side. Because you can buy scrub brushes that are very hard bristles in them, and then you can buy the softer ones. And you scrub these overalls with a scrub brush, and then when you’d have the front of the overalls done, well you’d slosh them around on the washboard and do the back of them! And then you’d slosh them around in this water, to get most of the soap out, and you’d get them into the rinsing water. But then, when the washers came around, overalls, well you’d put at last, ofter all the wash was done, then the overalls would be put into the washer and washed in the washer. It was much better. And the first washers that came out were wooden. The inside of them was, like you see, corrugated cardboard? Well, that’s how the inside of this tub was, it was all corrugated that way.

 AV: What year was that?

 HF: Oh, dear, I don’t know.

 AV: Did you have one?

 HF: Yes, our Pete brought his over to us, well, that would be, I would say that was around 1929 or 1930. But you had to, there was this, just like you have in the washer now that you can lift it out, you know the agitator. And that had an agitator in it, but it was right fastened to the top. And it was wooden, and that would agitate back and forth. But, there was a wheel on the top, the lid of the washer, that was the washer that I knew, there was a wheel on top, the lid, on the lid of the washer, and then there was these notches in it, but then there was a smaller wheel that went around, but you had on the side of the washer, there was a thing that came out from the wheel, and then you put a, there was a wooden stick in it, like a heavy broomstick. And you worked that back and forth. And that’s what was working the agitator, and that was washing the clothes. But then you didn’t have a wringer on there, you had to attach a wringer on there. When you thought the clothes were done, then you attached the wringer on there, and wrung your clothes out. I have one of those wringers up there in the garage. It’s not workable now, because we should have loosened the rolls on tehre when we hung it up there, but we didn’t, and it’s, the rolls are stuck together. So we should have loosened the rolls, because that’s rubber, and naturally rubber deteriorates. So, your wash day was an all day affair!

 AV: How long did it take about? When did you start?

 HF: It started in the morning, after, if there were children going to school, you’d get them off to school. And then you’d start your wash, and you were eight or eight thirty. Some of the women would get started much earlier, just like they do now, there’s some of them will get up real early in the morning, and they get their wash started and get their wash out before anyone else is up, so it was the same way in those days. And then, they would have children going to school, and naturally you, you’d come home, because the school was in town, you didn’t have to travel from one town to another. Everyone town had a school. And you’d come home at twelve o’clock for your lunch. Well, naturally, there’d be something that had to be prepared. Or, if there wasn’t anything prepared, you had your either bread and jelly or you would have your customary coffee. There was no fuss. I remember my mother made potato pancakes, well, if she wanted to make enough to satisfy us, she would hae to stand at that

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -4- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

148 stove all morning! Well, if you got three potato pancakes, that was really something. Whether you were hungry, or, you could have something else to eat, but you didn’t have as many pancakes as you wanted, because it was too much work. And then at suppertime, you came home, if the supper was ready, the supper wasn’t served until the men were ready for it. And you had your job to do before supper, either bring in the coal for the next day. I had to take care of the coal-oil lamp, trim the wick, wash the chimney, that was every night, you didn’t have to be told about it. You knew that was your job and you did it, without being told about it. You didn’t just pick up and go out and play. Well then, after our work was done, a gang of [?] kids [handwritten note in right hand column not decipherable] would meet out on the street, there wasn’t much traffic, because there were only horse and buggy. A dirt street, but it was good and solid. We’d be 161 out there playin’ all kinds of games. Made up our own games, and we didn’t need anyone to, any recreation board or anybody else to figure it out, an architect to set it up, we made our own games! It was a lot of fun.

 AV: This was when you were not keeping house, though. This was when you were younger.

 HF: When I was a kid, yeah.

 AV: How old were you?

 HF: Oh, well I should be able to remember from about the age of eight the things that were goin’ on, because I started school at six. And then already you were interested in what was goin’ on in the house, and you didn’t go wandering around, you were home. Like now, the children will go out to these swimming pools all day, just like our Anna’s Anna. The kid, she’ll go down at Okey’s all morning, she’s down at the swimming pool all day. But what she should do is keep her nose at home a little bit and help out at the house. Joe does a lot of the housework, but Anna’s down at the swimming pool, but we didn’t do that.

 AV: When you were younger, how much of the work did you have to do?

 HF: Well, if you had to help with the dishes, you helped with the dishes. And as I said, you had that certain job assigned to you and you had to do it. And you would start ironing at quite an early age. If there was a family, it was too much for the mother to do. And there was just the stove irons, 177 not electric irons. And some irons were good irons, those three that Mike showed you, they used to call them the sad irons.

 AV: Why?

 HF: Well, was it a trade name, or, I don’t know, but they used to call them the sad irons. But her irons were very good. They held the heat. And you didn’t have to change them as often as some of the irons. We had a set that was, oh, they were, the old people used to call them.….anyway, they were like dumb, (?) but you had to change them quite often. But her irons were very good. I used to like to iron with them. And we have our set of irons here yet.…See, here’s the sad iron, and why it is, is it on account of the trade name, or what it is, I don’t know, but anyway it’s a sad iron.

 AV: My goodness, they’re heavy.

 HF: They are, yes, they are. And you had to have your coal fire goin’ good, and you put them on the front lids of the stove, and if you had to do some thing you thought that they were gonna get too hot, you put them to the back of the stove, so t[?]at they wouldn’t, because you had to be careful so you don’t scorch. And we ironed. And the kids started to learn to do those things quite early.

 AV: When did you start?

 HF: Oh, I don’t know, but I know that I had to help out. You had to help out with everything. And then when the garden was planted, you still had to 197 help there, too. You were shown what to do, and you did it. And there

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -5- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

weren’t any insectisides then that they would spray everything and there’d be no bugs. You’d go through the potato patch with a can or a little bucket, and some kerosene, and water in it, and you’d go along and you’d look at the bushes of potatoes…did you ever see potatoe bushes? You’ll see them one day. they’re beginning to grow now, they’re coming out of the ground. When they’d get a little high, then we used to get these potato bugs on them. And if you didn’t get them off, they would eat the leaves, at least they’d make holes in the leaves of the potatoes. Well then that wasn’t good, because it would take thestrength out of them. So you’d go along and you’d look. Well, the young ones were just like little red, they were “squishy”, but the old ones already, they had wings, they were like striped wings on them, and you had to hold this little bucket under a bush, and you hit onto the bush and you shook the bugs into the bucket of kerosene and water! That’s what used to kill them. And then you’d look under the leaves, if you sort of suspected that there were eggs under the leaves, you’d look under the leaves, and if there were, you’d nip the leaf off, put it into the heosene. Well, there used to be big potato patches, and by the time you went through that potato patch, it would take you some time.

 AV: And all the kids had to do that?

 HF: Well, whoever planted a garden, and almost everyone planted a garden at that time. Because then you had, you’d put your potatoes in the cellar in the fall of the year, you had them for the whole winter, you didn’t have to worry about whether you were gonna be stuck for potatoes. You had them in the cellar, and they were good. And you had them down there, and you could…And the people who didn’t have such big cellars built their outside cellars. You know like the one up there by Mrs. Timko’s? And they used to put all their stuff in there. And even when they had cows, and they would put their crocks of milk in there, and that would keep cold, because there weren’t any refrigerators. And the houses were small, and they were crowded, because especially where there were boarders, they were crowded. And then there were families that had a lot of children, we only had five, but there were some that had a lot of children, where the place was really crowded. So they had thse big earthen crocks, and the people were so foolish when they had them, and then when there weren’t any more cows, people got rid of those crocks. Today you could get loads of money for them.

 AV: How long would the milk keep in them?

 HF: Oh, it kept for a long time. And then, people used to let it sour, to get sour milk.

 AV: How did they do that?

 HF: Well, you’d leave your sweet milk in the crock, and then cover it so that no flies or dirt or anything could get in. And after a certain time, you would see that the milk is beginning to sour, and when it would sour, it wasn’t anything like the buttermilk that you’re getting today. Some said that yogurt is like sour milk, but it’s far from it, far from it. The milk would be so solid that you could take and cut it with a spoon. We used to put it into a cup and eat it with a spoon. We’d some home from huckleberries, and it was so warm, that was the coolest thing you could eat. You ate that sour milk, that would cool you off. And the cream that was taken off the sour milk would be set aside, and when you had enough cream, then you’d put into a churn and start churning butter. That was quite a chore!

 AV: I bet! Did you do that?

 HF: Oh man, I used to get at that churn! And I’d just sit there and go up and down and up and down and up and down, and think the butter was never going to form! But you could tell when it was starting to form already, because it

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -6- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

251 was a little harder to pull up. But today, if I had a churn, and if I had the cream, I’d gladly churn the cream and make butter out of it. That was really good stuff. Then, after the butter was all made, it would be butter milk. And that was buttermilk, with chunks of butter in it. My mother would take and turn the, well the butter usually held on to the bottom of the, it was a round thing that had holes in it, it would hold onto the bottom of that. She would take that out and she’d put it into a clean pan, and she would spill all the buttermilk out of the churn. And that was saved. A lot of people liked to drink it. Then she would take the butter off that, I guess you’d call it an agitator, because that’s what it did, and she would with a wooden spoon she would press it down in cold water, and when that water got milky she would spill that water out and put clear cold water in again, and she would keep turning that butter around in there. Well, it was in a lump like, you know, it wasn’t separated, it was in a lump, but she would, again with a wooden spoon, she would press down on it until she got all of that milky stuff out, and when the water was clear, she would put the butter on a dish and she would form it into a mound. And you salted it as you needed it. It was unsalted, and it would keep. But if there was a lot of butter, if you had more than one cow and you couldn’t use the butter, then so it wouldn’t get rancid, they would put it on the stove, and they would let it, now I think they call it, clarified butter, and the gourmet on tv, he does almost all his cooking with clarified butter. (Is that the Galloping Gourmet?) Yeah. Well, then, that sediment forms on the bottom, and you drain off that butter and they used to put in into an earthen crock, and they would save that and that’s what they would cook with. They didn’t use it for bread, al ready, you know to put on bread as a spread, but they would use it for cooking.

 AV: What did they call it?

 HF: It was butter! Just butter. But it was already done so, if you kept the butter in its original form it would get rancid, but that didn’t get rancid.

 AV: Where did they store it?

 HF: Well, if you had a cellar, you could store it into a cellar. And as there were these outside cellars, they used to store a lot of things in there. 286 And everything would keep. In the wintertime it didn’t freeze, and in the summertime, it was cool in there, because there was so much earth put on top of that, it would keep it cool. So that was a chore that you had to do, had to be done, couldn’t wait. And then, in the fall of the year, if you didn’t have a garden big enough that you planted your own cabbage, you would go down to a farm, and tell the farmer how many heads of cabbage you’d want.

 AV: Who would to this?

 HF: Either the mother or the father, whoever was available would go down and talk 295 to the farmer. We used to go down to Evergreen Valley. That’s out past where you turn into the Flea Market? Well, you kept goin’ right out that road and you’d get out to the valley there, and there were some farms there that were far, there was a lot of space between them. And you would tell the farmer whether you wanted fifty head of cabbage or a hundred head of cabbage, it all depended on what a big family you had to feed. And then, you’d go down there while the cabbage was still in the field, and whenever he would cut the cabbage he would load up a wagon, well, the wagon looked a lot like those old cars down there, you know the back of the wagon would look that way. It didn’t have a top on it. And he would load up this cabbage on the wagon and bring it into town. And he could bring a few loads at the one trip. And then he had his orders, he would stop at that house and put off as many heads of cabbage as you had ordered. And when you were ready to put

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -7- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

cabbage in the barrel, you got a barrel and you scrubbed it out and scrubbed it out and scalded it out, left it outside for the air to dry it, and then you would bring it in.

 AV: Did you scrub it with soap?

 HF: You scrubbed it with soap, yes, because then it was rinsed out very well. It was scalded and everything else, it would be clean.

 AV: How did you scald it?

 HF: With boiling water, you’d pour water into it, and swish it around, and make sure that it was good and clean. And then, my mother used to spread a clean sheet over the carpet, and she had a loan of Machella’s cabbage cutter, because that was a big one, and almost everyone in town had a loan of it. I think of their boarders made it for them. And it was shaped so that it used to rest on two chairs, the one end on one chair, the other end on the other chair. And it was shaped on the one side, it was shaped like, well here it looked like a paddle, and then it came out here and it came out. Well you could sit on this, you had your one leg on the one side and the other on the other side, and then you would have this box where you cut your cabbage into halves, and you’d put this half into this box – I’ll show you mine that I have upstairs – and then you’d work it back and forth over these knives, you know you’d hold the cabbage with your hands and work it back and forth over these knives, and the cabbage was falling down underneath on to the clean sheet. And that would be done the day the cabbage was going to be put in the barrel, beforethe man of the house came home. And my dad would come home from work, and he would wash up. He did take a bath every night when he’d come home from work. A lot of them didn’t, but he did. And then he’d have a bite to eat, and then my mother would fix up a tub of water for him, and would put his feet into the tub of water, and he would soak them in there good, and with a little pocket knife he would scrape the back of his heels and the soles of his feet and his toenails he would cut and scrape the toenails that there wasn’t any dirt or anything in there. And she’d take that tub of water and empty it and give him clean water, and he would rince his feet out, and then she’d spread towels on the floor, that from the tub over to the barrel, he wouldn’t walk on the carpet. He walked on these clean towels. And she ahd a layer of cabbage in the bottom of the barrel, and you would salt it, and he would start walkin’ around and around and around, tamping down that cabbage! And before he would start, he would start, he would always say a little prayer, before he would start his work.

 AV: What did he say?

 HF: Oh, he would askthe Lord to bless his work and the sauerkraut would be good, I don’t remember, because it was one that he made up himself, you know, he’d just ask God’s blessing on it, and as he tamped that down, after a while the juice was coming out of the cabbage, all that water, and when he thought the first layer was tamped down well enough – if you didn’t tamp it down well enough, then your sauerkraut would go bad – then my mother would add, she had a bushel basket and she’d fill it and she’d add more cabbage to the barrel. And some more salt. And he’d go around and around and tamp that down. Then when he’d be about halfway up, he’d ask my mother to give him a bracer. Then she’d get the bottle of liquor out and she’d pour a glass of liquor for him! Then he’d tamp all over again. Sometimes I’d wonder that he didn’t get dizzy going around and around! Not just walking, mind, but you say, well he’s walking around – he didn’t! He went around this way (she demonstrates) around the sides and with his foot he would get the cabbage down, you know some of the cabbage was left laying along the side of the

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -8- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

barrel, and it was tamped down. And then get the center of it. And a barrel would take from a hundred to a hundred and twenty-fie head of cabbage. It all depend on the size of the cabbage. And then when he was near the top, well, me and our Anna used to run and get the apples, and those were my apples, those were her apples, there near the top of the barrel. And after the cabbage had fermented, well, after it was done, then there was a top that was right from the cabbage barrel that fitted into that groove that is around the top, but it was in two already, and then you fitted that, well it didn’t fit right into the groove, you put it down and there was a space around it, and then you had two blocks of wood that fitted across, these things would fit this way the blocks were put across. And a heavy stone was put on the top of that to hold that down. And for a few days that you had to leave it in a warm kitchen, you couldn’t put it where it was cold, and it’s stand in the kitchen until you’s watch, well in fact you’d know, when it was starting to ferment, because you could smell it. And even then you couldn’t take it in the cellar, until it was done fermenting. WHen it would start fermenting, then he would make a long, I don’t know what you would call it, it was like a tube, and there was a hole near the top of the barrel, a hole was made with a red hot poker, he would burn it through. And he would take from an elderberry bush a branch, and that was the easiest one to make a hole through, you had to make a hole through this branch, he’d cut the branch off about like that, and he would make a hole through there, and put it into this hole in the barrel. And he would put a bucket underneath, and water would keep dripping fromthe barrel. And then after a time he would take, lift off that rock, and take those things that were on top of the cabbage, you were to take them off and wash them off, because it used to get a scum on it. And over the top of the cabbage there were whole cabbage leaves that were laid over the top. Well then, you would take those cabbage leaves out and put them into a pan of water and wash them off from all that scum, and try to clear as much of that scum off the top as you possibly could. And then, natually, put everything back again, and wait, it would be fermenting, you wanted until it was, well it was that it would ferment for I wouldn’t have any idea for how long, was it two weeks it was that it would ferment? And naturally, you could smell it whenever you’d come into the house, but if you would put it down in the cellar or put it where it was cold, then your sauerkraut would get bitter. It wouldn’t be sour, it would be bitter.

 AV: It didn’t smell too good, then?

 HF: No, it didn’t smell too good, but when it was all fermented, then it smelled good. When you’d take the sauerkraut out of the barrel, the it’d smell good! So you could put up with that other smell, and then everyone knew what the smell was whenever they’d come into the house, nobody minded it, because almost everyon in town did that. They all that their own barrels of sauerkraut!

 AV: How long did it have to take between skimming off the sum from the top?

 HF: Well, you skimmed off the scum quite often. You know, you’d watch, whenever you thought that there was a little too much scum forming on it, then you would get a pan of cold water and you would take those things off and wash them clean and put it back on again.

 AV: It would be every two days?

 HF: Oh, I wouldn’t know whether it was every two days, or how often it was, but you used to just watch it. And the lady of the house did that. She owuld take care ofthat. ANd then when the cabbage was, they could see, they would look at it after a certain length of time, and if the cabbage was still white then they wouldn’t take it down in the cellar yet, it wasn’t through fermenting. But when it was through fermenting, then the cabbage had that, well,

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -9- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

422 like if you open a can of sauerkraut now, you see it isn’t white, it’s sort of a yellowish color. Well, then you knew that it was through fermenting. You could already take it down the cellar. I often wonder how the men did it, be cause it was down the steps. And these big barrels, they somehow would roll that barel down over on the landing of the steps of the cellar, and down those steps. One man would go ahead of it, and another man would stand at the top and hold it, you know, to try to hold it back, and they’d slowly roll it from one step to another to get it down. But that was hard work, to do that and get it down the cellar. And you’d put boards underneath, it wouldn’t be right on the bare ground. And anytime you needed sauerkraut, you took either a dishpan or something and went down the cellar and took your sauerkraut out of there. In the winterime, you’d get a layer of ice along with it! And bring it up, wash it out, so it wouldn’t be- because if you’d use it directly that way, it would be too sour. So they would rinse it out in clear water to get a lot of that sourness out. And cook it. And you’d have it with mashed potatoes, or, if you had pieces of pork rind, you’d put pork into the sauerkraut and cook it that way. And that’s what you’d get from supper! And the sauerkraut juice, well, they used to use it in different ways, I know that my mother often, she would dilute it with water until it was the taste that she wanted, and salt it, and put it on the stove to come to a boil, and then she would make, well, they were noodles, we used to call them “halushki”. 452 They were made with grated potatoes, and you added flour to these grated potatoes, and then you would roll the dough out just like you do noodle dough, but then you didn’t cut them like noodles, you would tear a piece of the dough off, and have your boiling water on the stove just like for noodles, and you’d tear pieces off this dough and drop them into the boiling water, and boil them until you knew they were boiled, and you would drain them, the same as noodles, and then you would have this sauerkraut juice, and instead of soup you would put the sauerkraut juice over these halushki, and that’s how you ate it. That was healthy!

 AV: Oh, yeah! My goodness! Did you boil the potatoes before you grated them?

 HF: No, they were raw, and that’s how you’d make that. So many times, that’s what you got for supper! And when you had sour milk, well then you mashed 467 potatoes, and you would eat, because at the factory we were talking about it, and the girl said well, how could you eat mashed potatoes with sour milk? Well, you had your sour milk in a cup, and your mashed potatoes were on the plate. You would take a spoonful of mashed potatoes and you would dip it down into the sour milk, and that’s how you ate it.

 AV: How did the people feed all their boarders?

 HF: The same way as themselves. They sat at a table, and the lady of the house would serve them. Well, she’d put the stuff on the center of the table and everyone would help themselves. And if there were too many, well then her children would be served next. And if there weren’t too may, they all sat at table together and they ate. Whatever the head of the house had, that’s 478 what the boarders had, too.

 AV: How did the boarders pay for their meals?

 HF: They used to pay by the month. If they did’t pay their butcher bills separately, then they would pay the lady whatever they would agree on, you know, when they came to board. And indeed, it wasn’t any forty dollars a month, that’s for sure. I really wouldn’t know what the price was, but I know it was a lot cheaper than that. In later years, when things got a little fancier, well then forty dollars wasn’t too much to ask, you know, for the food and the lodging and the laundry, and everything that had to be done for them.

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -10- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

488

 AV: When were these “later years”?

 HF: Oh, it was, I wouldn’t even know what year when boarders finally stopped coming. We had boarders up until around 1915, because my brother-in-law was a boarder when he married my sister Mary. And then after that, we didn’t have any more boarders. But there were some families, Mrs. Machella still had them even after that. But as they quit coming to this country, and the ones that were here had married, had their own homes, well then you didn’t have that call for boarders any more. It was only in the years when they were first coming from across that they would come here, and they didn’t have any fami lies, they didn’t have anyone, well then naturally they had to board until they would find someone that they would marry, or, there were a lot that left girlfriends in Europe, and after they came here and got work, and were settled, they would send for these girls, and they would come to this country and they would marry, and they would set up their own place. Because there were a lot of homes, and after all the coal companies did need the men, because I under stand that they used to send their agents overseas to recruit the men to come to work. So there was housing for them. And they would set up their house keeping, and then maybe if more came from Europe you got more boarders. As the years went on and these people settled, and the mines had enough men to do their work, well then, the boarders fell off, they didn’t have them any 514 more.

 AV: You mentioned before, there was two systems of paying.…

 HF: Yes, in some cases, the lady of the house, well the boarders would tell her what type of meat they’d want. The butcher would come, and she’d get the meat. But she used to do the cooking. And they used to get the meat, and she paid the butcher and she would keep track of it, how much it was for the family and how much it was for the boarders. Well then, at the end of the month, the boarders would share that up among themselves, they would divide it, each one would give his share towards that bill, and that’s how they paid for that. But then there were a lot of places, the boarders were satisfied to pay a straight fee, and to have the lady of the house buy all the stuff that was needed and do the cooking, and they would pay her, and then she would pay her 528 bills.

 AV: Who determined how many boarders were taken in?

 HF: Ha ha! The lady of the house! She was the one that had to do the work! Be cause naturally, her husband was working, and he couldn’t take time out to take care of the boarders. It was her job. And she would determine whether she could handle more boarders or not. Or if there was enough room for more. And then, every boarder had his own mattress, and as they were changing place because many times they would change their boarding place if they were dis satisfied with something they would change their boarding places, well then, they’d take their mattress and they’d go! And in the summertime, I heard my Dad talk about it, there weren’t any churches, and they didn’t have where to go to church – the closest church I guess was out in Shenandoah. Even now it’s a long distance. Well, then, they would take their mattresses and go 547 out on the yard under the trees and place their mattresses and sit there, lay there, during the day, and anyone that knew how to read, they had prayer books, they would, this man who knew how to read would read the mass, and the others would sit and they would listen.

 AV: Where would they do this?

 HF: Out in the yards, and you know, there were a lot of trees in the yards, not as 649 empty as some of the places around here now. Some of the people are getting wise and planting trees. At one time they didn’t realize that the trees add to your coolness, they add to your water supply, and the leaves of the trees

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -11- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1 553 even purify the air. But at one time, people, after they quit planting gar dens, they just planted lawns, and they didn’t want any trees, because there is a little bit of work, trimming around the trees. So they would lay under these trees, and they would…

 AV: Why would they lay on the mattresses?

 HF: Well, they didn’t want to lay on the bare ground, so they had the mattresses out. And then they would, anyone that knew how to read, and they had these different books on different articles from Europe, and the one that knew how to read would sit there and he would be reading, and the others would be listening to him.

 AV: Would this be in Slavic?

 HF: Yeah, um-hmm. Because there weren’t too many that knew the English language, 563 only the ones that were born in this country knew the English language. But then, little by little, they picked up the English language, even though they spoke it brokenly, but they picked up the English language, and they were able to get along, they knew what they wanted, and they were able to get along.

 AV: Were any of your boarders a read?

 HF: Well, the ones that we did have…though there was one we had, he couldn’t read, but he wanted to learn the English language and learn the different things in arithmetic. We were living up on the Back Street. And the woodwork in the house wasn’t painted white, and wasn’t enamel, it was just a flat paint. The door to our cellar was painted a gray, it was flat paint, you could write on there with chalk. Well, every night, we would have a class. I would write the numbers on the door, and he would sit there and he would try to figure them out. Well, after he learned a little about them, then he’d try to get funny and he would either let on that he doesn’t know what they are, or he would give the wrong answer, and I had a little ruler in my hand, and, he’d, well, what they did in school, I did too, and he’d get a slap in the palm of his hand with the ruler! But when we were done, I had to wash the door off, because my daddy said that can’t stay like that, that has to get washed. We were never, never allowed to chip anything in the house or destroy any of the wood. Like in some of the homes, they would carve their initials either in the door or in some part of the house. We were never allowed to do that. My dad would say that after all, you must take care of [handwritten words in the right hand column – can’t read] the house, as though it were your very own. Not feel that it’s a Company home. But we grew up with that idea, we never thought of it as a Company home. It was your own home and you had to take care of it. And if you de stroyed it, that was your own fault, and you had to look out for it yourself.

 AV: How old were you when you did that teaching?

 HF: Oh, gosh, I must have been about ten! I used to look forward to it, too. He would pull up the chair in front of the door, and it was time to start! He’s 598 dead now.

 AV: What other duties did the wife have when she had taken in boarders?

 HF: Well, she milked the cow, and the man of the house usually took the feed out to the cow, because the buckets were heavy. But she had to milk the cow, she took care of the milk. If you were selling milk to other people, it was her [handwritten word cow in the right hand column] job to, if they came to the house for milk, well then, you had to fill their cans for them. And if it was somewhere where they couldn’t come to the house, then you had children, your children would deliver the milk. Just like I, me and Stella were talking about it, well her and her sister Della, they would, one would go up the Main Street, the other would go up the Back Street, and as I said, they had a can hangin’ on every finger.

 AV: That was Stella Ugella?

 HF: Yeah, and her sister Della.

 AV: And at that time, what was her name?

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -12- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

HF: Stella Pulla. And before they grew up, well, their brother was the oldest in the family. Walter. Walter used to deliver the milk. But they had no other means of getting along. Her father was hurt in the mines. He was in the hospital for a long time. And then he, in a fever, he tried to get out of bed in the hospital, and he fell. He was giving the nurses a rough time, and he fell and he did something to his hip, and I don’t think that it was ever set right, and he was lame on that leg up until the time he died. He used to walk with a cane. But that’s how they were raising the family. Because if you got any compensation, it was very little. It really wasn’t anything that you could splurge on, that was for sure. So they used to have more than one cow, but their stable was as clean, everything was clean. They really worked hard to do that. And even when Mrs. Pulla would be going down to the stable to milk the cows, because sometimes, especially in the spring of the year, the cows would be late coming home. There weren’t any strippings, that you’d have to be afraid the cow was going to fall in the stripping or anything. So, the woods were clear, and the cows used to go in there, and they would travel, oh gradiuous, they’d travel miles. And they usually kept in a bunch, you know the town cows. And if they found good grazing place, they would forget to come home! Then you’d have to go out looking for them. You just about knew where they’d go, and you’d go out that way, and you’d call them by name, and you could recognize the bell of your cow. The bells ring and you knew yours. And you’d slowly walk in the back of them, you’d chase all of them home.

 AV: This was the duty of, who?

 HF: Of the kids. The kids would have to go out after them. And it was a pleasure chasing them home, you’d walk slowly in the back of them. And they would walk ahead. The bells were tinkling. At a certain time of the evening, when they’d be comin’ home from grazing, all you could hear is the tinkle of bells! And everybody recognized their own. Well, the cow would come in the back alley, there, and there were fences built, and a gate. And she’d put her head over the gate, and she’d “moooooo”! You knew she was home, it was time to take her feed up! And while she was feeding, the lady of the house would be miling the cow. And the milk buckets were pretty big, and there was a very fine screen on there, that you’d pour the milk through, that if you happened to get any of the hair from the cow into the milk, it was strained and would be laying on the screen. And the bucket was scoured out with boiling water before you’d go up to the stable, and the bucket really had a special place. It wasn’t just put any where. It had a special place, and it was kept clean. And then, over the bucket, there was like a thing that covered this way, and the rest of this was open.

 AV: It was halfway closed?

 HF: Well, no, the bucket wasn’t because then she couldn’t get the milk in there. But there was an extension on there and then this screen. It was like a, well, I guess you’d refer to it as a spout. But it wasn’t narrow, it was wide, and then there was this screen in there that nothing could go through that screen. And the lady of the house would put a dab of butter on the bucket when she was going up to the stable, and she’d have clean water, and she would sit down she would wash the udder with water. And then she’d put a little bit of that butter on her hands and on the tits of the cow, you know, and that way it was easy for her to pull and then it didn’t irritate the cow. Otherwise, it could irritate the cow. And some of the cows, if they didn’t know their owner, untilthey got used to the owner, they wouldn’t let the milk com. They couldn’t milk, but the cow wouldn’t release the milk. They usually knew their owner. And she would be feeding while you’d be milking her. And, if it

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -13- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

was someone strange, well, you always had to watch, so that the bucket didn’t get kicked to the other side of the stable! And then there was a trick to knowing how to milk. There was a rhythm to it. You’d hear the milk comin’ into the bucket, it was a steady rhythm. You’d hear the milk comin’ in. And the way, if you’d watch them use their hands, it wasn’t that you just pull here and pull here. There was a steady rhythm, just like that. And whenever they’d have two emptied, then they would go on to the others. And sometimes you’d get a large size bucket full of milk. The cows were wonderful.

 AV: Did you milk them?

 HF: Oh, no, I never did. Because I wasn’t old enough by the time we got rid of our last cow. And the reason we had to, was, my mother went down with the rheumatism. And she wasn’t able to take care of it, and her sister came down to take care of her, and she wouldn’t take care of the cow. And my sister Mary wasn’t, I don’t know whether she was fourteen or not, even fourteen at that time. And then my dad had to go to the school directors and ask their permission to have her released from school because their was no one to do the work in thehouse. So. I don’t know whether she was about fourteen or not, even that, when she was released from school, because there was no one to take care of the house. You could do that, but you had to go to the school directors, and get their permission before you were able to do it. And I suppose the school directors would talk to the principal of the school, and they would check up on it, to make sure that you were telling the truth, before they would release a child from school. Because our Mary was married at the age of sixteen, so it was, I don’t know about how old she could have been when my mother had that rheumatism. There wasn’t anyone to take care of the cow, so then finally my dad sold her to Mr. Sargossy, to slaughter.

 AV: Who was he?

 HF: He was the butcher in Freeland, and he used to come through here selling meat. And, oh we hated to see poor Bessie go. You could make pets out of them. But she never had horns, because every time her horns would grow a little bit, and she’d go into the woods and all, and she would root with her horns and she would break them off! So she very seldom haddhorns on. But we could really pet her up. She’d be standing in the alley before my mother would come up to let her into the stable. Because the stable was built so that as he came in from the alley she could go right into the door of the stable. There was like a crib, and there was separations in there, that the cow could get her head in there and get that hay. But you fed her other things besides hay. They used to buy chop, and they would cook it with either potatoes that you didn’t have for your own use any more, you would cook them seperately with the skins on, and any kind of vegetables that you wanted to get rid of you didn’t thow out, but you cooked them seperately, and then you would add water to his chops, and add hot water to it, and add these vegetables, and you would feed that to the cow. Because if you just fed her hay, you wouldn’t get the amount of milk that you wanted. And then, in buying the chop, you’d have to be careful that there weren’t pieces of wire or anything in it, because sometimes, when they were processing that chop, there could be, and it would drop in, and if there was, or a piece of nail or anything, and if there was, if the cow ate that, they knew she was a goner, because it would stay in her stomach and you wouldn’t be able to get it out.

 AV: Who would prepare the chop for the cow?

 HF: The lady of the house. Sometimes the man would help, if he wasn’t doing anything else. But usually, the lady. And then when it was ready to be taken

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -14- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

up to the stable, the men would take it up, because it was heavy. And he would take it up, and before the cow would be left in, we’d go out there you know and pet her and put her head along side of her; the kids miss that, well they don’t know what they miss. But.…

 AV: What else did the lady of the house have to do for the boarders? Did she have to wash them?

 HF: Wash them? She’d have to prepare their water. And, see, the way they would wash, well we had the wooden tubs at that time, and they would kneel at the tub, and she ahd water prepared in the tub for them. They’d kneel at the tub, and put thier elbows in and lean over, and she would wash their back, mind, there weren’t bought washclothes at that time, either. They were underwear that was worn out, we would cut the best pieces out and save them, and naturally they were things that held water. They weren’t like the Turkish towels, but they held water, and that’s what you used for washclothes. And the lady of the house would wash their backs for them, and they would do all the rest for themselves. And then she would, as I said, she would wash their clothes for them, and if there was any mending to be done, she did it.

 AV: That must have taken a lot of time.

 HF: Oh, indeed it did, indeed it did. Because in the evenings when, ah, my nephew was staying with us, and was working for Ringfel? in the lumberfield, well, when they were in the same forest cutting lumber, well naturally you were gonna get caught onto some of the boughs, and you were gonna tear your clothes, so every night when he’d come home – and he’d come home pretty late – and I think he was getting a dollar a day. Today the kids wouldn’t waslk down the street for a dollar a day. My dad would talk and talk and tell him You don’t have to do that, you have what to eat, you have your clothes, don’d do it. A dollar a day, that’s slave labor. And now the niggers have something to holler about! Well, our people never complained about it. They went ahead, they did it. Not only our people, there were Dutch people and everyone else that did it, and noone complained, there was no discrimination, that went, Oh you’re treated better than the next one is treated, that didn’t go. There was no discrimination, everyone got along. And every night when John would come home from work, my mother would sit at the kitchen table patchin’, because he always came home with some of his clothes torn. She’d be patchin’, my dad says, you’ll see, your grandmother is, if you were to pay he for her time that she wastes in patching your clothes, you’d never have one cent left. But the kid wouldn’t quit, because it was wonderful work, he always did like the woods. And especially in the wintertime, they’d be out there and it would start snowin’, and he’d come home from work and he’d say, Oh, God?, if you only knew how nice that snow was, oh that was wonderful, how nice that was comin’ down. It didn’t come down that way out here in town like it does in the woods. That’s nice. And the kid worked there until he got his finger smashed. And my mother was patchin’ every night, every night.

 AV: Did you patch, too, your self?

 HF: No, no, because by that time already I did the ironing, any of the other things that were to be done, and she would sit and she’d patch.

 AV: How did you schedule the chores that had to be done?

 HF: Well, you never scheduled them, it was just, one thing that had to be done after another, and as you did one thing, you knew the next thing had to be done, and just went ahead and you did it! There were no schedules! Anna would pick up teh empty buckets, and walk to the coal shed and fill the buckets and bring them down so my mother would have coal for the next day, that she wouldn’t have to go up and carry it. And I’d bring the lamp down from up-

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -15- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

stairs and the kitchen lamp, and make a basin of water, wash the chimneys of the lamps, and then fill the lamps with kerosene, and wash the outside of the lamp, trim the wicks, make sure the wick was long enough, that it wasn’t too short, that after you turned the wick up then you would be out of the kerosene and you wouldn’t get any light. And then, trim the top of the wick, that when you light the lamp that it wasn’t shootin’ out in all directions, but it would just be a nice, you know, round light. Oh, yeah, you had your chores and you did them! Today, all they do is pull the cord!

 AV: And what else did you have to do when you came home from school?

 HF: Well, it all depend what time of year it was. If it was the fall of the year, you had to pluck feathers from the geese. And after slaughtering the pigs, then the casings had to be cleaned, washed, scraped. You’d have tubs of water standing, with the casings in there, and you’d have to clean them, turn them inside out, and then there was a, you had a board, you’d lay them on there, and then with a little knife you would scrape until you got all that film off the casings. They were so thin that you could see through them. And they were rinsed out in water all the time, and then they were set aside, and that’s what sausage was made out of. You would grind your meat, and you used any kind of seasonings in it, and you would stuff the sausage, those casings, and at first they used to use a teaspoon to get the filling into the casings, and then with, you’d hold it with one hand, with the other you’d pull it down.

 AV: Who used to do that?

 HF: The lady of the house, and the children would help. And sometimes, the man of the house wasn’t doin’ anything, he would help. Then, they got a machine that you could pull the casing onto this, it was a machine that, you’d put the meat in there, and then there was a thing that would press down on it. And there was like a pipe that came out from the bottom of this machine and you would pull your casing onto there. And you would press down on this and the meat would go through. But in many cases, it didn’t want to work. It was a waste of time. And I’ve already seen that on mixers, on electric mixers that they have a contraption now. I saw the Galloping Gourmet use it, but he had a problem with it! I believe you’d stuff them sooner with a teaspoon!

 AV: So you’d stuff the casings.…

 HF: You’d stuff the casings, and then you’d tie the ends of the casing so that the meat didn’t come out, with a string. And then, whenever you wanted them, you’d either smoke them, or, if you wanted them fresh, you would cook them.

 AV: Right then?

 HF: Well, you’d keep them and cook them whenever you needed them. If you were gonna hold them for any length of time, you smoked them. Then they wouldn’t go bad. And you would eat them just like you can buy this pork sausage now. And you would cook it, and that it delicious. I love pork sausage. I don’t know whether you do or not. (I do) I’m glad you do, because I do! And then we used to make a sausage out of, they would save the blood from a pig, and then you would cook; it wasn’t rice, it was more like a barley, and this blood would, I think, I’m not positive but I think it was cooked with the barley, and then you stuffed that, and then whenever they wanted it they would cook it in a little of butter, or at the time they used to use a lot of lard, because it was home-rendered lard, it was pure. And then they would take this out of the casing, and they would put it into this pan, it was a skillet-like, and they would liet it fry forwhile, and then you would eat it with bread.

 AV: Now this was stored in the casing, it wasn’t cooked and eaten in the casing, like a sausage?

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A. varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -16- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

HF: No, it would be stored, well, you wouldn’t see it would have to be boiled first if you wanted to use the casing. You had to boil it first. Well then, in that case, if could get mushy. And so if they fried it, it didn’t. You rendered your own lard. You’d kill pigs, usually on Thanksgiving Day was slaughter day. And they knew how to cut the pig apart, and they would get these slabs of fat. Well they would cut their bacon, they knew how to cut to get the bacon, and the hams, and then the different cuts of meat. Because the pig was raised for that purpose. And they’d cut these pieces of fat. They often had pieces of meat runnign through them, and on the order of slabs of bacon, if you ever saw a slab of bacon. And then you would, one evening you would sit cuttin’ that into small cubes. And you wouldn’t do it that night, because it had to be watched a lot, but it was a big job gettin’ that all cut. And you’d put it into a pan, and you’d wait until the next morning, and fix the fire in your stove. And you would use bread pans, you know these black bread pans? And you would put these cut up pieces into the bread pan, and you’d put them into the oven. And then, you wouldn’t close the oven tight, so that that grease would slowly come out. And you’d keep them in there until these pieces were browned. And when they were browned, you’d take that out of the oven, and you’d have to be careful that you didn’t spill it, because that was pure lard, and on a hot oven it would catch fire. And you would take it, you had earthen crocks, because everyone had a lot of earthen crocks. And you would pour off this lard, and try to save those pieces that were browned in there, because, it wouldn’t melt to the very bottom. And if there were a good bit of meat through the pieces, you would save that. And, gee, I forget what they called them in English, but they were good to eat, they were darn good to eat!

 AV: What did they call them in your way?

 HF: In our way, we used to call them Squarki, some people called them zhumarkec And I did hear them in English already. And then some of the women used to use them whenever they would make pirougi, and they’d pour the brown butter over, and then the pieces of these in there would give them a good flavor. My mother never did. But oh, I ate a lot of those squarki, all right! They were tasty!

 AV: How did you eat them?

 HF: Just plain, you’d just fill your mouth with them and eat! You didn’t eat them one by one, you ate them by the mouthful! And we used to look for the ones that had these ribbons of meat through the middle. They were good, they were really good! And if there was a piece of rind on there, well then you had the rind to chew on.

 AV: That was tasty, too?

 HF: They were tasty. Well then, you had pure lard, and you could use it, my brother-in-law, Anna’s husband, used to love it on, he’d put lard on bread, and put it into the oven and let it melt and soak into the bread, and that’s what he used to like. I like butter that way, but I don’t think I would like lard. But he did, and he often did that.

 AV: So, what did you do with the melted lard?

 HF: You would save it, and whatever, at that time, there wasn’t margarine, and when you would do your cooking, and if it could be done with lard, like if they’d go to stew meat, well now you have Crisco, you have oil, you use that. But in those days they didn’t have it, they would use the lard. But that lard was pure, and if, well they learned to make pies, they would use that lard in piecrust.

 AV: Did it get solid after.…

 HF: Oh, yes, it would get solid, it would be as white as white could be, it

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -17- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

would be good and solid. Well, not exactly white, because see those things used to brown, and your lard would be more on a yellowish side, and if you got the pure white lard, well, you could buy that pure white, but the women didn’t like that, because they didn’t consider that pure, they didn’t think that it was rendered – they used to call that rendering lard – they didn’t think it was rendered enough. But I’m trying to think of the name in English of those – and there is a name for it, I heard the name so many times and I don’t remember it anyhow – but I know I ate it! Oh, those were the days, and there was no refrigerator, and you’d slaughter, well you’d slaughter pigs, you’d slaughter a cow, well, how we were gonna save the meat? The hams, the bacon, and the sausages were smoked. Well, they would keep. But the rest of the meat – well, there was a barrel, just like the sauerkraut barrels. And some of them were – Machella’s had a tremendous one, because they had board ers, and they really had a big barrel. I don’t know how many gallons went into that barrel. Well, you would wash up all the meat after it was all cut up after it was slaughtered. You’d wash up that meat, you’d put a layer of meat in the bottom, you’d add salt to it, pour a good bit of salt into it. Then you’d add another layer of meat on top, put a layer of salt. And you would do that until you would use up all of your meat. And then you’d make a salty brine, and put it in. And the meat would keep. Then when you needed meat, you would go and you would take meat out of the barrel and put it into water and let it soak to get that brine out of it. Let it soak. And then you would use it for whatever you wanted it. If it was pork and you wanted to do a pork, you would do it, and if you wanted, if it was beef and you wanted to make soup, you would take the piece out that you wanted for soup, and you would cook soup out of it.

 AV: Who did that, who put up this pork?

 HF: Well, the man helped, and the woman, the lady of the house helped. They would work together and get that done.

 AV: Where would they put the barrel?

 HF: Of all places, the parlor?

 AV: Why the parlor?

 HF: That was the coldest place in the house! You wouldn’t take it down the cellar because the cellar was damp. But you would put it in the parlor. And of course you didn’t entertain boyfriends in the parlor! There weren’t any parlor suites! I remember Machella’s parlor, there was a barrel of meat standing there. I was a kid, I don’t know, about nine or so, or eight, and I wasn’t allowed to do the cleaning at home, because naturally I didn’t know how to do it. My sister Mary would do it, and I didn’t have to interfere. Well, if I would go over to Machella’s I could do whatever I wanted to do. My line of cleaning was, you know, whatever you came across as you were sweeping, whatever you came across, it went ahead of the broom. You didn’t pick it up, it went ahead of the broom. And if it was upstairs, everything was swept downstairs! If somebody would do that for me today, I’d knock their head off! But Mrs. Machella never interefered with me. I could do whatever I wanted to do. If was fine. So they had, you didn’t buy cookies by the pound, you bought them by, it was a wooden box, oh I should say it was this big – long – wide – and there was a lid on it, it used to open on hinges. And you had so many different kind of cookies in this box.

 AV: Where did you buy it from?

 HF: From the grocer. Because you didn’t buy it by the pound, how long would a pound last! They weren’t cakes, you know layer cakes and all that.… you put a bowl of cookies out on the table.…so you’d go to this box of cookies you know, and pick out what you liked. There were cookies with the

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -18- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

peanuts, the halves of peanuts were stuck on the top of them, they were the peanut cookies. We used to look for that. Molasses cookies were always left until the end. There were ginger cookies in there, there were, any kind of cookie you wanted was in there, a whole assortment. And there were a couple layers in the box, not one layer, because the box was, I guess, about this high.

 AV: About twenty inches high?

 HF: Oh, I don’t know about how high that would be. But anyway, that would stand in the parlor, too.

 AV: How much was that box?

 HF: Oh, I have no idea. Prices didn’t interest me then. You know, I didn’t have to pay them! But.…

 AV: Would a lot of people buy their cookies instead of make them?

 HF: Well, a lot of them didn’t know how to bake those things, at that time. And then, they wouldn’t have the time, because they’d bake bread. That was one thing they did bake, they baked bread, and they baked it in those outside ovens.

 AV: And your mother used that?

 HF: My mother didn’t have an outside oven, not in our yard, almost everyone did. She baked in the stove. But Mrs. Machella had a big outside oven. And when ever she baked bread, it wasn’t two or three loaves. Because of all those boarders. Two or three loaves you could slice that up for two meals.

 AV: What did it look like, her oven?

 HF: Oh, I couldn’t describe it. I was tellin’ you once before how that oven was made. The men used to make it themselves. There were bricks in it, there was…they’d have this clay that they would have between the bricks, and the fire, I don’t know whether the fire was underneath or was it in the back of the oven. You know, in the back of it, where you put your bread on, I should think it would be heavy sheets of iron that were on the bottom, and then you put your pans of bread on there.

 AV: How large was that surface?

 HF: Oh, that was, you could get quite a few pans of bread on that.

 AV: Was it square or round?

 HF: Well, the inside of it was more on the wide side than the long side. And then the top of it was made, well, they had like a roof and all made over the top of that. But the oven itself was made of brick, clay, because they didn’t go using cement at that time. And then there was a heavy iron door, well, it was a sheet of iron, that you put up against the oven to keep it closed whenever the bread was bakin’. And then you would take, there was like a handle on it that you could take it down. And there was a long, like a hoe, it was made like a hoe, and you could reach in to get your pans of bread with that.

 AV: What did you call it?

 HF: I wouldn’t have any idea what they called it, it was made for a purpose, to pull, if your pans of bread were way back, well you couldn’t reach in there, you had to pull them out with this, like a big scraper. And to put the bread in there, they had like a iron paddle, like. There was a long handle on it, and you would put your pan of bread on there and you would reach way back in and put it back into your oven, because you couldn’t reach that far with your arm to get your bread in. And when they’d bring the bread out of that oven boy, the loaves were really big. They were good.

 AV: So the lady of the house had to do all that.

 HF: Um-hmm, that was her job.

 AV: How many loaves did she bake a week?

 HF: I wouldn’t have any idea. But they baked a couple times a week, especially

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -19- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

if they had boarders. You couldn’t go out and buy bread, like you can now. You run out of your own bread, you can just go out and buy whatever you want. You couldn’t do that. So, almost everything was done at home, and even noodles, today you buy them, at that time you couldn’t buy them, you had to make them.

 AV: Were they made often in the house?

 HF: Any time that they had soup or anything that they would use noodles for. It’s no problem, it’s no job. Even the rolling out isn’t bad. I used to think it was at one time, when I had to do it, whether I liked it or not, I had to do it! But since I have to do it for myself.…I don’t do it too often, be cause you, on noodles, you have to use pressure, because your dough has to be good and hard. If you leave your dough soft, then your noodles are mushy. So you have your dough good and hard, well then you have to use pressure on that rolling pin, you know, to get it rolled out. And since I have trouble with this left hand, if I use pressure on it, then my hand itches me too much, and really makes me miserable. But like dough for pridohe, I don’t have to have it that hard. It has to be on the softer side, or if it wouldn’t, then you couldn’t stick them together. You know whenever you fill them, and you have to stick them together, you wouldn’t be able to. And so they used to do all that themselves, and then they used to make what we call halushkis, they were made from a noddle dough, but not, the dough wasn’t as hard as the noodle dough, anyway, because then your halushki wasn’t as…they didn’t taste so good, because they would be too, too hard. It was all right the noodles, because the noodles you ate with soup. But the other things you ate with stewed cabbage, or some ate them with sour milk, some ate them with cottage cheese – you had your own cottage cheese – and you would crumble up this cottage cheese, you’d boil your halushkis just like you did noodles, and you’d have your cottage cheese crumbled. After you’d have your halushkis drained, you’d crumble this cottage cheese over them and pour some browned butter over them, and that’s how you ate them.

 AV: Did they make them for people when they had boarders?

 HF: Oh yes, A dish like that went a long way. But they didn’t make, you know, a little bowel like this.

 AV: They didn’t, eh!

 HF: They had a big pan! It was hard work, it was really hard work. That’s why those women kept so slim. I didn’t remember any fat women in those days. They were all good and slim. Because they got the exercise, all right. And if there were children in the house, well, there was a lot of work there, too, because they had to be fed, and she didn’t fuss around too much, like down at our Anna’s now, when the kids are comin’ home for lunch, this one likes to mato soup, well, they’re gonna open a can of tomato soup, that one likes something else, well that one, they’ll cook something else for that one. Everyone has something different. In those days, they would butter you a piece of bread and jelly, and give you a cup of coffee and keep your mouth shut! And if you managed to get, if the mother was able to spare a little bit of time, she would make some potato cakes, well then that was really something. That was a special dinner!

 AV: Good!.…You want a cup of coffee now?

 HF: Ha ha!

 AV: I think you’re gonna have a cup of coffee!

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Angela Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -1- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

 AV: Tell me about the woman’s role in the mining town.

 HF: Well, the women raised their families and took care of their boarders, cooked on coal stoves, took a long time to cook! Washed clothes on a washboard, do I have to say how many tubs they had to go through?

 AV: Sure!

 HF: Well, they washed the clothes out in the first tub, put in the second tub, poured hot water over it, and then washed clothes out of the second tub, put them into a boiler, and chipped some soap into the boiler, added water, put it on the stove, let it boil. And after they’d boil a while – that is, the white clothes – then they would take the boiler off and put the clothes into a tub of cold water, and not rub them any more, just slosh them around in the cold water, and then put them into the rinsing water. And there they would rinse them out, and whatever.…In the beginning they didn’t have any wringers at all, they had to wring all of their clothes out by hand. Later on, they got the wringers that were attached to a tub. And it was so much easier, because all the, like the sheets and the big things were hard to wring out. Even the children wore long underwear, and it was all that fleece lined underwear, and that was heavy. But they still wrung out with their hands until they got the wringers. Then they put them through the wringers. So, washing clothes was an all-day job, you’d start in the morning, didn’t finish until the evening!

And, then they had to do all the work that was necessary in the house, all the cleaning. No carpet, no linoleum. The floor was scrubbed. And, with about ten or twelve boarders in the house, pretty hard to keep them clean. But they did.

And then, in the summertime, when berries were out, regardless of how much work they had at home, they still went out for berries, picked berries. Be cause that was an income for them. The men weren’t making much – a dollar for ten hours.

 AV: Who would do their housework when they went out for berries?

 HF: They would do their housework before they would go out. And then, they didn’t have all the fancy furniture and all that to take care of. Everything was plain, as I told you. They didn’t have, when there were so many boarders, or even, we didn’t have that many boarders because we only had that I remember two or three at a time, but there were people who had, like Mrs. [????] my God, she had a load of boarders. If anyone came from across, and came looking for work, the boss would send them down to [M????????], because they said that they can’t get board anywhere. Well, they sent ’em down there, and they knew that, regardless of how, she would take them in. And nobody was, fussy about their food, there wasn’t a lof of fancy food. She’d usually make a pot of sauerkraut and put pieces of pork in it, and potatoes, and that was the meal. There was no fussin’ around with fancy foods and salads and all that cooked stuff, none of that. Everything was plain, rather. And they didn’t have chairs to go around the table. Even the tables were home made. (Yes?) Oh, yes indeed they were home made. In later years, they were real long, and they were just home made, anything that they could serve their meals on. And then, instead of chairs, they had benches. They would put long benches, if the table was long, or either put two benches on a side, and that’s what they did, they didn’t have chairs.

 AV: Who made these benches?

 HF: The men themselves.

 AV: The boarders?

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -2- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

HF: Well, either the men of the house, or if the boarders understood how to do those things, they did. But if they didn’t, well, then, the man of the house, if he understood how to do a little bit of hammering and sawing, they weren’t anything fancy. Because you can see that one that I have in the shanty, that’s one of those benches. I can remember that way, way, way back. And the bigger one that we had, a longer one, well that one broke. It was so worn out that it finally gave in. So when we were movin’ from the Back Street down to this street, we didn’t even take it. We left it up there. It wasn’t worth takin’ down here. And.…

 AV: This one here was made by your father?

 HF: I think it was made by one of the boarders. My dad wasn’t very handy with tools. If there was something that had to be fixed, he would fix it, but he was never very hand with tools. After my brother John was old enough, he understood more about it, my dad didn’t, even in later years if he had to fix something, it goes to such a rigamarole before he’d get everything assembled, and then, a chewin’ tobacco had to be first, before he could assemble any thing, no matter what he was gonna do something, whether it was goin’ out in the garden, no matter what he was gonna do, he would take time out to put a chew of tobacco in. My mother always said, well you can’t even think without the chew of tobacco in your mouth! And he alway chewed tobacco, always. So, then, every piece of clothes wasn’t ironed, as long as they were washed, they were clean. They weren’t ironed. And then the men, all their working clothes, there was no laundries around, like just a number of years ago, before all the mines closed, there was a laundry in Freeland, the men could take their working clothes there, and they were washed for them, and they were mended.…

 AV: Who did that?

 HF: [????????] had the laundry over in Freeland. The laundry is still there, I don’t know whether it is still in operation or not, but it’s still there, right above that bridge, you know, when we go under on that old road, well, right above that bridge. He used to be one of the partners in the overall factory, and then after John died, then they dissolved that partner ship and they sold out to Mr. Abrams. So that’s when he started up this laundry, and he had a lot of work there, but then, as everyone else, as he was growing older, his health was beginning to fail, and he got to the point where he couldn’t very well remember. But I saw him not too long ago, and he looked very well, and I talked to him some time in the winter. I met him on Center Street, and I talked to him for quite a while, and he looks a lot better than he did. For a while there, they were afraid to let him drive his truck or anything because his memory was so bad, but it seems that he has improved. But he used to do the laundry, and if there was any mending to be done, he had a sewing machine right there in the laundry, because I was coming home early from work one day, and I hadda stop at Griffith’s lumber yard for something, and this laundry is right across the road, and Olan came out, and he asked me to go into see, you know, how it is worked, and he had me sit down to one of the sewing machines that he has there, the sewing machines we have, and he did all the mending, and then they would deliver the clothes home for the miner. So they didn’t have to wash their clothes, but even in my mother’s time when my dad worked, she did all of this wash, all of his clothes were washed overalls, usually, well, on the washboard. You couldn’t take them and rub them like you did the other clothes. You would spread the overalls out, you’d have the washboard in the tub, and the water, a little bit of water in there, and you would take and you’d spread the over alls on the washboard, and you’d rub them with soap, and then with a scrub-

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -3- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

brush…

 AV: What kind of soap?

 HF: Always yellow soap. We used to use Fels-Naptha most of the time. Then there was another bar of yellow soap, I don’t remember now what the name of if was, but we usually used Fels-Naptha, because that has got a bit of naptha in it, and we thought it cleaned much better. And with a scrub brush, not one of these coarse brushes, it was more on the softer side. Because you can buy scrub brushes that are very hard bristles in them, and then you can buy the softer ones. And you scrub these overalls with a scrub brush, and then when you’d have the front of the overalls done, well then you’d turn them around on the washboard and do the back of them! And then you’d slosh them around in this water, to get most of the soap out, and you’d get them into the rinsing water. But then, when the washers came around, overalls, well you’d put at last after all the wash was done, then the overalls would be put into the washer and washed in the washer. It was much better. And the first washers that came out were wooden. The inside of them was, like you see, corrugated [??)] cardboard? Well, that’s how the inside of this tub was, it was all corrugated that way.

 AV: What year was that?

 HF: Oh, dear, I don’t know.

 AV: Did you have one?

 HF: Yes, our Pete brought his over to us, well, that would be, I would say that was around 1929 or 1930. But you had to, there was this, just like you have in the washer now that you can lift it out, you know the agitator. And that had an agitator in it, but it was right fastened to the top. And it was wooden, and that would agitate back and forth. But, there was a wheel on the top, the lid, of the washer, that was the washer that I knew, there was a wheel on the top, on the lid of the washer, and then there was these notches in it, but then there was a smaller wheel that went around, but you had on the side of the washer, there was a thing that came out from the wheel, and then you put a, there was a wooden stick in it, like a heavy broomstick. And you worked that back and forth. And that’s what was working the agitator, and that was washing the clothes. But then you didn’t have a wringer on there, you had to attach a wringer on there, and wrung your clothes out. I have one of those wringers up there in the garage. It’s not workable now, because we whould have loosened the rolls on there when we hung it up there, but we didn’t, and it’s, the rolls are stuck together. So we should have loosened the rolls, because that’s rubber, and naturally rubber deteriorates. So, your wash day was an all day affair!

 AV: How long did it take about? When did you start?

 HF: It started in the morning, after, if there were children going to school, you’d get them off to school. And then you’d start your wash, and you were eight or eight thirty. Some of the women would get started much earlier, just like they do now, there’s some of them will get up real early in the morning, and they get their wash started and get their wash out before anyone else is up, so it was the same way in those days. And then, they would have children going to school, and naturally you, you’d come home, because the school was in town, you didn’t have to travel from one town to another. Everyone town had a school. And you’d come home at twelve o’clock for lunch. Well, naturally, there’d be something that had to be prepared. Or, if there wasn’t anything prepared, you had your either bread and jelly or you would have your customary coffee. There was no fuss. I remember my mother made potato pancakes, well, if she wanted to make enough to satisfy us, she would have to stand at that

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every night, you didn’t have to be told about it. You knew that was your job and you did it, without being told about it. You didn’t just pick up and go out and play. Well then, after our work was done, a gang of kids would meet out on the street, there wasn’t much traffic because there were only horse and buggy. A dirt street, but it was good and solid. We’d be 161 out there playin’ all kinds of games. Made up our own games, and we didn’t need anyone to , any recreation board or anybody else to figure it out, an architect to set it up, we made our own games! It was a lot of fun.

AV: This was when you were not keeping house, though. This was when you were younger.

HF: When I was a kid, yeah.

AV: How old were you?

HF: oh, well I should be able to remember from about the age of eight the things that were goin’ on, because I ssarted school at six. And then already you were interested in what was goin’ on in the house, and you didn’t go wandering around, you were home. Like now, the children will go out to these swimming pools all day, just like our Anna’s Anna. The kid, she’ll go down at [O.…’s] all morning, she’s down at the swimming pool all day. But, what she should do is keep her nose at home a little bit and help out at the house Joe does a lot of the housework, but Anna’s down at the swimming pool, but we didn’t do that.

AV: When you were younger, how much of the work did you have to do?

HF: Well, if you had to help with the dishes, you helped with the dishes. And as I said, you had that certain job assigned to you and you had to do it. And you would start ironing at quite an early age. If there was a family, it was too much for the mother to do. And there was just the stove irons, 177 not electric irons. And some irons were good irons, those three that Mike showed you, they used to call them the sad irons.

AV: Why?

HF: Well, was it a trade name, or, I don’t know, but they used to call them the sad irons. But her irons were very good. They held the heat. And you didn’t have to change them as often as some of the irons. We had a set that was oh, they were, the old people used to call them.…., anyway they were like dumb, but you had to change them quite often. But her irons were very good. I used to like to iron with them. And we have our set of irons here yet.… See, here’s the sad iron, and why it is, is it on account of the trade name, or what it is, I don’t know, but anyway it’s a sad iron.

AV: My goodness, they’re heavy.

HF: They are, yes, they are. And you had to have your coal fire goin’ good, and you put them on the front lids of the stove, and if you had to do something you thought that they were gonna get too hot you put them to the back of the stove, so that they wouldn’t, becausse you had to be careful so you don’t scorch. And we ironed. and the kids started to learn to do those things quite early.

AV: When did you start?

HF: Oh, I don’t know, but I know that I had to help out. You had to help out with everything. And then when the garden was planted, you still had to 197 help there, too. You were shown what to do, and you did it. And there

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -5- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

weren’t any insectisides then that they would spray everything and there’d be no bugs. You’d go through the potato patch with a can or a little bucket, and some kerosene, and water in it, and you’d go along and you’d look at the bushes of potatoes…did you ever see potato bushes? You’ll see them one day. they’re beginning to grow now, they’re coming out of the ground. When they’d get a little high, then we used to get these potato bugs on them. And if you didn’t get them off, they would eat the leaves, at least they’d make holes in the leaves of the potatoes. Well then that wasn’t good, because it would take the strength out of them. So you’d go along and and you’d look. Well, the young ones were just like little red, they were “squishy”, but the old ones already, they had wings, they were like striped wings on them, and you had to hold this little bucket under a bush, and you hit onto the bush and you shook the bugs into the bucket of kerosene and water? That’s what used to kill them. And then you’d look under the leaves, if you sort of suspected that there were eggs under the leaves, you’d look under the leaves, and if there were, you’d nip the leaf off, put it into the kerosene. Well, there used to be big potato patches, and by the time you went through that potato patch, it would take you some time.

 AV: And all the kids had to do that?

 HF: Well, whoever planted a garden, and almost everyone planted a garden at that time. Because then you had, you’d put your potatoes in the cellar in the fall of the year, you had them for the whole winter, you didn’t have to worry about whether you were gonna be stuck for potatoes. You had them in the cellar, and the cellars were good. And you had them down there, and you could.… And the people who didn’t have such big cellars built their outside cellars. You know like the one up there by Mrs. Timko’s? And they used to put all their stuff in there. And even when they had cows, and they would put their crocks of milk in there, and that would keep cold, because there weren’t any refrigerators. And the houses were small, and they were crowded, because especially where there were boarders, they were crowded. And then there were families that had a lot of children, we only had five, but there were some that had a lot of children, where the place was really crowded. So they had these big earthen crocks, and the people were so foolish when they had them, and then when there weren’t any more cows, people got rid of those crocks. Today you could get loads of money for them.

 AV: How long would the milk keep in them?

 HF: Oh, it kept for a long time. And then, people used to let it sour, to get sour milk.

 AV: How did they do that?

 HF: Well, you’d leave your sweet milk in the crock, and then cover it so that no flies or dirt or anything could get in. And after a certain time, you would see that the milk is beginning to sour, and when it would sour, it wasn’t anything like the buttermilk that you’re getting today. Some said that yougurt is like sour milk, but it’s far from it, far from it. The mild would be so solid that you could take and cut it with a spoon. We used to put it into a cup and eat it with a spoon. We’d come home from huckleberries, and it was so warm, that was the coolest thing you could eat. You ate that sour milk, that would cool you off. And the cream that was taken off the sour milk would be set aside, and when you had enough cream, then you’d put into a churn and start churning butter. That was quite a chore!

 AV: I bet! Did you do that?

 HF: Oh, man, I used to get at that churn! And I’d just sit there and go up and down and up and down and up and down, and think the butter was never going to form! But you could tell when it was starting to form already, because it

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -6- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

251 was a litle harder to pull that up. But today, if I had a churn, and if I had the cream. I’d gladly churn the cream and make butter out of it. That was really good stuff. Then, after the butter was all made, it would be buttermilk And that was buttermilk, with chunks of butter in it. My mother would take and turn the, well the butter usually held on to the bottom of the, it was a round thing that had holes in it, it would hold onto the bottom of that. She would take the buttermilk out of the churn. And that was saved. A lot of people liked to drink it. then she would take the butter off that, I guess you’d call it an agitator, because that’s what it did, and she would with a wooden spoon she would press it down in cold water, and when that water got milky she would spill that water out and put clear cold water in again, and she would keep turning that butter around in there. Well, it was in a lump like, you know, it wasn’t separated, it was in a lump, but she would, again with a wooden spoon, she would press down on it until she got all of that milky stuff out, and when the water was clear, she would put the butter on a dish and she would form it into a mound. And you salted it as you needed it. It was unsalted, and it would keep. But if there was a lot of butter, if you had more that one cow and you couldn’t use the butter, then so it wouldn’t get rancid, they would put it on the stove, and they would let it, now I think they call it, clarafied butter, and the gourment on tv, he does almost all his cooking with clarified butter. (Is that the Galloping Gourmet?) Yeah. Well then, that sediment forms on the bottom, and you drain off that butter and they used to put in into an earthen crock, and they the would save that and that’s what they woud cook with. They didn’t use it for bread, already, you know to put on bread as a spread, but they would use it for cooking.

AV: What did they call it?

HF: It was butter! Just butter. But it was already done so, if you kept the butter in it’s original form it would get rancid, but that didn’t get rancid.

AV: Where did they store it?

HF: Well, it you had a cellar, you could store it into a cellar. And as there were these outside cellars they used to store a lot of things in there. 286 And everything would keep In the wintertime it didn’t freeze, and in the summertime, it was cool in there, because there was so much earth put on top of that it would keep it cool. So that was a chore that you had to do, had to be done, couldn’t wait. And then, in the fall of the year, if you didn’t have a garden big enough that you planted your own cabbage, you would go down to a farm, and tell the farmer how many heads of cabbage you’d want.

AV: Who would do this?

HF: Either the mother or the father, whoever was available would go down and talk 295 to the farmer. We used to go down to Evergreen Valley. That’s out past where you turn into the Flea Market? Well, you kept goin’ right out that road and you’d get out to the valley there, and there were some farms there that were far, there was a lot of splace between them. And you would tell the farmer whether you wanted fifty head of cabbage or a hundred head of cabbage, it all depended on what a big family you had to feed. And the, you’d go down there while the cabbage was still in the field, and whenever he would cut the cabbage he would load up a wagon, well, the wagon looked a lot like those old cars down there, you know the back of the wagon would look that way. It didn’t have a top on it. And he would load up this cabbage on the wagon and bring it into town. And he could bring a few loads at the one trip. And then he had his orders, he would stop at that house and put off as many heads of cabbage as you had ordered. And when you were ready to put

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -7- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

309 cabbage in the barrel, you got a barrel and you scrubbed it out and scrubbed it ould and scaled it out, left it outside for the air to dry it, and then you would bring it in.

AV: Did you scrub it with soap?

HF: You scrubbed it with soap, yes, because then it was rinsed out very well. It was scalded and everything else, it would be clean.

AV: How id you scald it?

HF: With boiling water, you’d pour boiling water into it, and swish it around, and make sure that it was good and clean. An then, my mother used to spread a clean sheet over the carpet, and she had a loan of Machella’s cabbage cutter, because that was a big one, and almost everyone in town had a loan of it. I think one of their boarders made it for them. and it was shaped so that it used to rest on two chairs the one end on one chair, the other end on the other chair. And it was shaped on the one side, it was shaped like, well here it looked like a paddle, and then it came out here and it came out. Well, you could sit on this, you had your one leg on the one side and the other ob the other side, and then you would have this box where you cut your cabbage into halves, and you’d put this half into this box – I’ll show you mine that I have upstairs – and then you’d work it back and forth over these knives, you know you’d hold the cabbage with your hands and work it back and forth over these knives, and the cabbage was falling down underneath on to the clean sheet. And that would be done the day the cabbage was going to be put in the barrel, before the man of the house caame home. And my dad would come home from work, and he would wash up. He did take a bath every night when he’d come home from work. A lot of them didn’t, but he did. And then he’d have a bite to eat, and then my mother would fix up a tub of water for him, and he would lput his feet into this tub of water, and he would soak them in there good, and with a little pocket knife he would scrape the back of his heels and the soles of his feet and his toenails he would cut and scrape the toenails that there wasn’t ony dirt or anything in there. And she’d take that tub of water and empty it and give him clear water, and he would rinse his feet out, and then she’d spread towels on the floor, that from the tub over to the barrel, he wouldn’t walk on the carpet. He walked on these clean towels. And she had a layer of cabbage in the bottom of the barrel, and you would salt it, and he would start walin’ around and around and around, tamping down the cabbage! And before he would start, he would start, he would always say a little prayer, before he woul start his work.

AV: What did he say?

HF: Oh, he would ask the Lord to bless his work and the sauerkraut would be good. I don’t remember, because it was one that he made up himself, you know, he’d just ask God’s blessing on it, and as he tamped that down, after a while the juice was coming out of the cabbage, all that water, and when he thought the first layer was tamped down well enough – if you didn’t tamp it down well enough, then your sauerkraut would go bad – then my mother would add, she had a bushel basket and she’d fill it and she’d add more cabbage to the barrel. And some more salt. And he’d go around and around and tamp that down. then when he’d be about halfway up, he’d ask my mother to give him a bracer. then she’d get the bottle of liquor out and she’d pour a glass of liquor for him! Then he’d tamp all over again. Sometimes I’d wonder that he didn’t get dizzy going around and around! Not just walking, mind, but you say, well he’s walking around – he didn’t! He went around this way (she demonstrates) around the sides and with his foot he would get the cabbage down, you know some the the cabbage was left laying along the side of the

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A Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -8- 6/15/72 Tape 14-[?]

363 barrel, and it was tamped down. And then get the center of it. And a barrel would take from a hundred to a hundred and twenty-five head of cabbage It all depend of the size of the cabbage. And then when he was near the top, well, me and our Anna used to run and get the apples, and those were my apples, those were her apples, there near the top of the barrel. And after the 370 cabbage had fermented, well, after it was done, then there was a top that was right from the cabbage barrel that fitted into that groove that is around the top, but it was already in two already, and then you fitted that, well it didn’t fit right into the groove, you put it down and there was space around it, and then you had two blocks of wood that fitted across, these things would fit this way, the blocks were put acrosw. And a heavy stone was put on the top of that to hold that down. And for a few days that had had to leave it in a warm kitchen, you couldn’t put it where it was cold, and it’d stand in the kitchen until you’d watch, well in fact you’d know, when it was starting to ferment, because you could smell it. and even then you couldn’t take it in th cellar, until it was done fermenting. When it would start fermenting, then he would make a long, I don’t know what you would call it, it was like a tube, and there was a hole near the top of the barrel, a hole was made with a red hot poker, he would burn it through. And he would take from an elderberry bush a branch, and that was the easiest one to make a hole through, you had to make a hole through this branch, he’d cut the branch off about like that, and he wold make a hole through there, and put it into this hole in the barrel. And he would put a bucket underneath, and water would keep dripping from the barrel. And then after a time he would take, lift off that rock, and take those things that were on top of the cabbage, you were to take them off and wash them off, because it used to get scum on it. And over the top of the cabbage there were whole cabbage leaves that were laid over the top. Well, then you wold take those cabbage leaves out and put them into a pan of water and wash them off from all the sum, and try to clear as much of that scum off the top as you possibly could. And then, naturally, put everything back again, and wait, it would be fermenting, you waited until it was, well it would ferment for I wouldn’t have any idea for how long, was it two weeks it was that it would ferment? And naturally, you could smell it whenever you’d come into the house, but if you would put it down in the cellar or lput it where is was cold, then your sauerkraut would get bitter. It wouldn’t be sour, it would be bitter.

AV: It didn’t smell too good, then?

HF: No, it didn’t smell too good but when it was all fermented, then it smelled good. When you’d take the sauerkraut out of the barrel, then it’d smell good! So you could put up with that other smell, and then everyone knew what the smell was whenever they’d come into the house, nobody minded it, because almost everyone in town did that. They all had their own barrels of sauerkraut!

AV: How long did it have to take between skimming off the scum from the top?

HF: Well, you skimmed off the scum quite often. You know, you’d watch, whenever you thought that there was a little too much scum forming on it, then you would get a pan of cold water and you would take those things off and wash the clean and put it back on again.

AV: It would be every two days?

HF: Oh, I wouldn’t know whether it was every two days, or how often it was, but you used to just watch it. And the lady of the hosue did that. She would take care of that. And then whe the cabbage was, they could see, they would look at it after a certain length of time, and if the cabbage was still white then they wouldn’t take it down in the cellar yet, it wasn’t through fermenting. But whe it was through fermenting, then the cabbage had that, well,

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -9- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

422 like if you open can of sauerkraut now, you see it isn’t white, it’s sort of a yellowish color. Well then, you knew that it was through fermenting. You could already take it down the cellar. I often wonder how the men did it, because it was down the steps. And these big barrels, they somehow woud roll that barrel down over the landing of the steps of the cellar, and down those steps. One man would go ahead of it, and another man would stand at the top and hold it, you know, to try to hold it back, and they’d slowly roll it from one step to another to get it down. But that was hard work, to do that and get it down the cellar. And you’d put boards underneath, it wouldn’t be right on the bare ground, And anytime you needed sauerkraut, you took either a dishpan ort something and went down the cellar and took your sauerkraut out of there. In the wintertime, you’d get a layer of ice along with it! And bring it up, wash it out, so it wouldn’t be- because if you’d use it directly that way, it would be too sour. So they rinse it out in clear water to get a lot of that sourness out. And cook it. And you’d have it with mashed potatoes, or if you had pieces of pork rind, you’d put pork into the sauerkraut and cook it that way. And that’s what you’d get for supper! And the sauerkraut juice, well, they used to use it in different ways, I know that my mother often, she would dilute it with water until it was the taste that she wanted, and salt it, and put it on the stove to come to a boil, and then she would make, well, they were noodles, we used to call then “halushki”. 452 They were made with grated potatoes, and you added flour to these grated potatoes, and then you would roll the dough out just like you do noodle dough, but then you didn’t cut them like noodles, you would tear a piece of the dough off, and have your boiling water on the stove just like for noodles, and you’d tear pieces off this dough and drop them into the boiling water, and booil them until you knew they were boiled, and you would drain them, the same as noodles, and then you would have this sauerkraut juice, and instead of soup you would put the sauerkraut juice over thesse halushki, and that’s how you ate it. That was healthy!

AV: Oh yeah! My goodness! Did you boil the potatoes before you grated them?

HF: No, they were faw, and that’s how you’d make that. So many times, that’s what you got for supper! And 467 when you had sour milk, well then you mashed potatoes, and you wouled eat, because at the factory we were talking about it, and the girl said well, how could you eat mashed potatoes with sour milk? Well you had your sour milk in a cup, and your mashed potatoes were on the plate. You would take a spoonful of mashed potatoes and you would dip it down into the sour milk and that’s how you ate it!

AV: How did the people feed all their boarders?

HF: The same as themselves. They sat at a table, and the lady of the house would serve them. Well, she’d put the stuff on the center of the table and everyone woud help themselves And if there were too many, well then her children would be served next. And if there weren’t too many, they all sat at the table together and they ate. Whatever the head of the house had, that’s 478 what the boarders had, too.

AV: How did the boarders pay for their meals?

HF: They used to pay by the month. If they didn’t pay their butcher bills separately, then they would pay the lady whatever they would agree on, you know, when they came to board. And indeed, it wasn’t any forty dollars a month, that’s for sure. I really wouldn’t know what the price was, but I know it was a lot cheaper than that. In later years, whe things got a little fancier, well then forty dollars wasn’t too much to ask, you know, for the food and the lodging and the laundry, and everything that had to be done for them.

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -11- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

553 even purify the air. But at one time, people after they quit planting gardens, they just planted lawns, and they didn’t want any trees, because there is a little bit of work trimming around the trees. So they would lay under these trees and they would…

AV: Why would they lay on the mattresses?

HF: Well, they didn’t want to lay on the bare ground, so they had the mattresses out. And then they would, anyone that knew how to read, and they had these books on different articles from Europe, and the one that knew how to read would sit there and he would be reading, and the others would be listening to him.

AV: Would this be in Slavic?

HF: Yeah, um-hum, because there weren’t too many that knew the English language, 563 only the ones that were born in this country knew the English language. But then, little by little, they picked up the English language, even though they spoke it brokenly, but they picked up the English language, and they were able to get along, they knew what they wanted, and they were able to get along.

AV: Were any of your boarders a reader?

HF: Well, the ones that we did have… though there was one we had, he couldn’t read, but he wanted to learn the English language and learn the different things in arithmetic. We were living up on Back Street. And the woodwork in the house wasn’t painted white, and wasn’t enamel, it was just a flat paint. the door to our cellar was painted a gray, it was flat paint, you could write on there with chalk. Well, every night, we would have a class. I would write the numbers on the door, and he woud sit there and he would try to figure them out. Well, after he learned a little about them, then he’d try to get funny and he would either let on that he doesn’t know what they are, or he would give the wrong answer, and I had a little ruler in my hand, and he’d, well, what they did in school, I did too, and he’d get a slap in the palm of his hand with the ruler! But when we were done, I had to wash the door off, because my daddy said that can’t stay like that, that has to get washed. We were never allowed to chip anything in the house or destroy and of the wood. Like in some of the homes, they would carve their initials either in the door or in some part of the house. We were never allowed to do that. My dad would say that after all, you must take care of the house, as though it were your very own. Not feel that it’s a Company home. But we grew up with that idea, and we never thought of it as a Company home. It was your own home and you had to take care of it. And if you destroyed it, that was your own fault, and you had to look out for it yourself.

AV: How old were you when you did that teaching?

HF: Oh, gosh, I must have been about ten! I used to look forward to it, too. He would pull up the chair in front of the door, and it was time to start! He’s 598 dead now.

AV: What other duties did the wife have when she had taken in boarders?

HF: Well, she milked the cow, and the man of the house usually took the feed out to the cow, because the buckets were heavy. But she had to milk the cow, she took care of the milk. If you were selling milk to other people, it was her job to, if you came to the house for the milk, well then, you had to fill their cans for them. And if it was somewhere where they couldn’t come to the house, then you had children, your children woud deliver the milk. Just like I, me and Stella were talking about it, well her and her sister Della, they would, one would go up the Main Street, the other would go up the Back Street, and as I said, they had a can hangin’ on every finger.

AV: That was Stella U[?????]

HF: Yeah, and her sister Della.

AV: And at that time, what was her name?

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -12- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

612 HF: Stella Pulle [?}. And before they grew up, well their brother was the oldest in the family. Walter. Walter used to deliver the milk. But they had no other means of getting along. Her father was hurt in the mines. He was in the hospital for a long time. And then he, in a fever, he tried to get out of bed in the hospital, and he fell. He was giving the nurses a rough time, and he fell and he did something to his hip, and I don’t think that it was ever set right, and he was lame on that leg up until the time he died. He used to walk with a cane. But that’s how they were raising the family. Because if you got 626 any compensation, it was very little. It really wasn’t anything that you could splurge on, that was for sure. So they used to have more than one cow, but their stable was as clean, everything was clean. They really worked hard to do that. And even when Mrs Pulli[?] would be going down to the stable to milk the cows, because sometimes, especially in the spring of the year, the cows 632 woud be late coming home. There weren’t any strippings, that you’d have to be afraid the cow was going to fall in the stripping or anything. So, the woods were clear, and the cows used to go in there, and they would travel, oh gracious, they’d travel miles. And they usually kept in a bunch, you know the town cows. And if they found good grazing place, they would forget to come home! Then you’d have to go out looking for them. You just about knew where they’d go, and you’d go out that way, and you’d call them by name, and you could recognize the bell of your cow. the bells ring and you knew yours. And you’d slowly walk in the back of them. If there were more of the town cows out there, then you got all of them, you’d chase all of them home.

AV: This was the duty of, who?

HF: Of the kids. the kids would have to go out after them. And it was a pleasure 645 chasing them home, you’d walk slowly in the back of them. And they would walk ahead. The bells were tinkling. At a certain time of the evening, when they’d be comin’ home from grazing, all you could hear is the tinkle of bells! And everybody recognized their own. Well, the cow would come in the back alley, there, and there were fences built, and a gate. And she’d put her head over the gate, and she’d “moooooo”! You knew she was home, it was time to take her feed up! And while she was feeding the lady of the house would be milking 659 the cow. And the milk buckets were pretty big, and there was a very fine screen on there, that you’d pour the milk through, that if you happened to get any of the hair from the cow into the milk, it was strained and would be laying on the screen. And the bucket was scoured out with boiling water before you’d go up to the stable, and they bucket really had a special place. It wasn’t just put any where. It had a special place, and it was kept clean. And then, over the bucket, there was like a thing that covered this way, and the rest of this was open.

AV: It was halfway closed?

HF: Well, no, the bucket wasn’t because then she couldn’t get the milk in there. But there was an extension on there and then this screen. It was like a, well I guess you’d refer to it as a spout. But it wasn’t narrow, it was wide, and then there was this screen in there that nothing could go through that screen. And the lady of the house woud put a dab of butter on the bucket when she was going up to the stable, and she’d have clean water, and she would sit down, she would wash the udder with water. And then she’d put a little bit of that butter on her hands on on the tits of the cow, you know, and that way it was easy for her to pull and then it didn’t irritate the cow. Otherwise, it could irritate the cow. And some of the cows, if they didn’t know their owner, until they got used to the owner, they wouldn’t let the milk come. They couldn’t milk, but the cow wouldn’t release the milk. They usually knew their owner. And she woud be feeding while you’e be milking her. And if it

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -13- 6/15/72 Tpe 14-1

[???] was someone strange, well, you always had to watch, so that the bucket didn’t get kicked to the other side of the stable! And then there was a trick to knowing how to milk. There was a rhythm to it. You’d hear the milk comin’ into the bucket, it was a steady rhythm. You’d hear that milk comin’ in. And the way, if you’d watch them use their hands, it wasn’t that you just pull here and pull here and pull here. There was a steady rhythm, just like that. And whenever they’d have two emptied, then they would go on to the others. And sometimes you’d get a large size bucket full of milk. The cows were wonderful.

AV: Did you milk them?

HF: Oh, no, I never did. Because I wasn’t old enough by the time we got rid of our last cow. And the reason we had to, was, my mother went down with rhematism. 703 And she wasn’t able to take care of it, and her sister came down to take care of her, and she wouldn’t take care of the cow. And my sister Mary wasn’t, I don’t know whether she was fourteen or not, even fourteen at the time. And then my dad had to go to the school directors and ask their permission to have her released from school because there was no one to do the work in the house. So. I don’t know whether she was about fourteen or not, even that, when she was released from school, because there ws no one to take care of the house. You could do that, but you had to go to the school directors and get their permission before you were able to do it. And I suppose the school directors would talk to the principal of the school, and they would check up on it, to make sure that you were telling the truth, before they would release a child from school. Because our Mary was married at the age of sixteen, so it was, I don’t know about how old she could have been when my mother had that rheumatism. There wan’t anyone to take care of the 722 cow, so then finally my dad sold her to Mr. [????????], to slaughter .

AV: Who was he?

HF: He was the butcher in Freeland, and he used to come through here selling meat. And, oh we hated to see poor Bessie go. You could make pets out of them. But she never had horns, because every time her horns would grow a little bit, and she’d go out into the woods and all, and she woled root with her horns and she would break them off! So she very seldom had horns on. But we could really pet her up. She’d be standing in the alley before my mother would come up to let her into the stable. Because the stable was built so that as she came in from the alley she could go right into the door of the stable. There was like a crib, I guess it is a crib that they call it, and you’d put your hay into that crib, and there was separations in there, that the cow could get her head in there and get that hay. But you fed her other things besides hay. They used to buy chop, and they would cook it with either potatoes that you didn’t want to have for your own use any more, you would cook them separately with the skins on, and any kind of vegetables that you wanted to get rid of, you didn’t throw out, but you cooked them separately, and then you would add water to this chops, and add hot water to it, and add these vegetables, and you would feed that to the cow. Because if you just fed her hay, you wouldn’t get the amount of milk that you wanted. And then, in buying the chop, you’d have to be careful that there weren’t pieces of wire or anything in it because sometimes, when they were processing that chop, there could be, and it would drop in, and if there was, or a piece of nail or anything, and if there was, if the cow ate that, they knew she was a goner, because it would stay in 760 her stomach and you wouldn’t be able to get it out.

AV: Who would prepare the chop for the cow?

HF: The lady of the house. Sometimes the man would help, if he wasn’t doing anything else. But usually, the lady. And then when it was ready to be taken

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -14- 6/15/72 Tape- 14-1

763 up to the stable, the man would take it up, because it was heavy. And he would take it up, and before the cow would be left in, we’d go out there you know and pet her and put our head along side of her; the kids miss that, well, 770 they don’t know what they miss. But.….

AV: What else did the lady fo the house have to do for the boarders? Did she have to wash them?

HF: Wash them? She’d have to prepare their water. And, see, the way they would wash, well we had the wooden tubs at that time, and they woud kneel at the tub and she had water prepared in the tub for them, They’d kneel at the tub, and put their elbows in and lean over, and she would wash their back, mind, there weren’t bought washcloths at that time either. they were underwear that was worn out, we would cut the best peices out and save them, and naturally they were things that held water. They weren’t like the Turkish towels, but they held water, and that’s what you used for washcloths. and the lady of the house would wash their backs for them, and they would do all the rest for themselves, And then she would, as I said, she would wash their clothes for them, and if there was mending to be done, she did it.

AV: That must have taken a lot of time.

HF: Oh, indeed it did, indeed it did. Because in the evenings when, ah, my 791 nephew was staying with us and he was working for Ringfel[?] in the lumber-field, well, when they were in the forest cutting lumber, well naturally you were gonna get caught onto some of the boughs, and you were gonna tear your clothes, so every night when he’d come home – and he’d come home pretty late – and I think he was getting a dollar a day. Today the kids wouldn’t walk down the street for a dollar a day. My dad would talk and talk and tell him you don’t have to do that, you have what to eat, you have your clothes, don’t do it. A dollar a day, that’s slave labor. And now the niggers have something to holler about! Well, our people never complained about it. They went ahead, they did it. Not only our people, there were Dutch people and everyone else that did it, no on one complained, there was no discrimination, that went, oh you’re treated better than the next one is treated that didn’t go. There was no discrimination, everyone got along And every night when John would come home from work, my mother would sit out at kitchen table patchin’, because he always came home with some of his clothes torn. She’d be patchin, my dad says, you’ll see, your grandmother is, if you were to pay her for her time that she wastes in patching your clothes, you’d never have one cent left. But the kid wouldn’t quit, because it was wonderful work, he always did like the woods. And especially in the wintertime, they’d be out there and it would start snowin’, and he’d come home from work and he’d say, Oh, Jed[??], if you only knew how nice that snow was, oh that was wonderful, how nice that was comin’ down. It didn’t come down that way out here in town like it does in the woods. That’s nice. And the kid worked there until he got his finger smashed. And my mother was patchin’ every night, every night.

AV: Did you patch too, your self?

HF: No, no, because by that time already I did the ironing, any of the other 827 things that were to be done, and she would sit and she’d patch.

AV: How did you schedule the chores that had to be done?

HF: Well, you never shceduled them, it as jut, one thing had to be done after another, and as you did one thing, you knew the next thing had to be done, you just went ahead and you did it! There were no schedules! the only thing when we come home from school, the first thing was our Anna would pick up the empty buckets, and walk to the coal shed and fill the buckets and bring the down so my mother would have coal for the next day, that she wouldn’t have to go up and carry it. And I’d bring the lamp down from up-

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -15- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

837 stairs and the kitchen lamp, and make a basin of water, wash the chimneys of the lamps, and then fill the lamps with kerosene, and wash the outside of the lamp, trim the wicks, make sure the wick was long enough, that it wasn’t too short, that after you turned the wick up then you would be out of the kerosene and you wouldn’t get any light. And then, trim the top of the wick, that when you light the lamp that it wasn’t shootin’ out in all directions, but it would just be a nice, you know, round light. Oh, yeah, you had your chores 850 and you did them! Today, all they do is pull the cord!

AV: And what else did you have to do when you came home from school?

HF: Well, it all depended that time of the year it was. If it was the fall of they year, you had to pluck feathers from the geese. And after slaughtering the pigs, then the casings had to be cleaned, washed, scraped. You’d have tubs of water standing, with the casings in there, and you’d have to clean them, turn them inside out, and then there was a, you had a board, you’d lay them on there, and then with a little knife you would scrape until you got all that film off the casings. They were so thin that you could see through them. And they were rinsed out in the water all the time, and then they were set aside, and that’s what sausage was made out of. You would grind your meat, and if you used any kind of seasonings in it, and you would stuff the sausage, those casings, and at first they used to use a teaspoon to get the filling into the casings, and then with, you’d hold it with one hand, with the other you’d pull it down.

AV: Who used to do that?

HF: The lady of the house, and the children would help. And sometimes, if the man of the house wasn’t doin’ anything, he would help. Then, they got a machine that you could pull the casing onto this, it was a machine that, you’d put the meat in there, and then there was a thing that would press down on it. And they was like a pipe that came out from the bottom of this machine and you would pull your casing onto there. And you wold lpress down on this and the meat would go through. But in many cases, it didn’t want to work. It was a waste of time. And I’ve already seen that on mixers, on electric mixers that have a contraption now. I saw the Galloping Gourmet use it, but he had a problem with it! I believe you’d stuff them sooner with a teaspoon!

AV: So you’d stuff the casings.….

HF: You’d stuff the casings, and then you’d tie the ends of the casings so that the meat didn’t come out, with string. And then, whenever you wanted them, you’d either smoke them, or, if you wanted them fresh, you would cook them.

AV: Right then?

HF: Well, you’d keep them and cook them whever you needed them. If you were gonna hold them for any length of time, you smoked them. Then they wouldn’t go bad. And you would eat them just like you can buy this pork sausage now. And you would cook it, and that it delicious. I love pork sausage. I don’t know whether you do or not. (I do) I’m glad you do, because I do! And then 708 we used to make a sausage out of they would save the blood from a pig, and then you would cook; it wasn’t rice, it was more like a barley, and this blood would, I think, I’m not positive but I think it was cooked with the barley, and then you stuffed that, and then whenever they wanted it they would cook it in a little of butter, or at that time they used to use a lot of lard, because it was home-rendered lard, it was pure. And then they woud take this out of the casing, and they would put it into this pan, it was a skillet -like, and they would let it fry for awhile, and then you would eat it with bread.

AV: Now this was stored in the casisng, it wasn’t cooked and eaten in the casing, like a sausage?

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -16- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

926 HF: No, it would be stored, well, you wouldn’t, see it would have to be boiled first if you wanted to use the casing. You had to boil it first. Well then, in that case, it could get mushy. And so if they fried it, it didn’t. You rendered your own lard. You’d kill pigs, ususally on Thanksgiving Day was 934 slaughter day. And you knew how to cut the pig apart, and they would get these slabs of fat. Well they would cut their bacon, they knew just how to cut to get the bacon, and the hams, and the different cuts of meat. Because the pig was raised for that purpose. And they’d cut these pieces of fat. They often had pieces of meat running through them, and on the order of slabs of bacon, if you ever saw a slab of bacon. And then you would, one evening you would sit cuttin’ that into small cubes. And you wouldn’t do it that night, because it had to be watched a lot, but it was a big job gettin’ that all cut. And you’d put it into a pan, and you’d wait until the next morning, and fix the fire in your stove. And you would use bread pans, you know those black bread pans? And you would put these cut up pieces into the bread pan, and you’d put them into the oven. And then, you wouldn’t close the oven tight, so that the grease would slowly come out. And you’d keep them in there until these pieces were browned. And when they were browned, you’d take that out of the oven, and you’d have to be careful that you didn’t spill it, because that was pure lard, and on a hot oven it would catch fire. And you would take it, you had earthen crocks, because everyone had a lot of earthen crocks. And you would pour off this lard and try to save those pieces that were browned in there, because, it wouldn’t melt to the very bottom. And if there were a good bit of meat through the pieces, you would save that. And, gee, I forget what they called them in English, but they were good to eat, they were darn good to eat!

AV: What did they call them in your way?

HF: In our way, we used to call them squarki, some people call them zhumarhec [?]. And I did hear them in English already. And then some of the women used to 983 use then whenever they would make pirouhi, and they’d pour the brown butter over, and then the pieces of these in there would give them a good flavor. My mother never did. But oh, I ate a lot of those Squarkis, all right! They were tasty!

AV: How did you eat them?

HF: Just plain, you’d just fill your mouth with them and eat! You didn’t eat them one by one, you ate them by the mouthful! And we used to look for the ones that had these ribbons of meat through the middle. They were good, they were really good! And if there was a piece of rind on there, well then you had the rind to chew on.

AV: That was tasty, too?

HF: They were tasty. Well then, you had pure lard, and you could use it, my brother-in-law, Anna’s husband, used to love it on, he’d put lard on bread, and put it into the oven and let it melt and soak into the bread, and that’s what he used to like. I like butter that way, but I don’t think I would like lard. But he did, and he often did that.

AV: So, what did you do with the melted lard?

HF: You would save it, and whatever, at the that time, there wasn’t margarine, and when you would do your cooking, and if it could be done with lard, like if they’d go to stew meat, well now you have Crisco, you have oil, you use that. But in those days they didn’t have it, they would use lard But that lard was pure, and if, well they learned to make pies, they would use that lard in piecrust.

AV: Did it get solid after……

HF: Oh, yes, it would get solid, it would be as white as white could be, it

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -17- 6/15/72 Tae 14-1

1014 would be good and solid. Well, not exactly white, because see those things used to brown, and your lard would be more on a yellowish side, and if got the pure white lard, well, you could buy that pure white, but the women didn’t like that, because they didn’t consider that pure, they didn’t think that it was rendered – they used to call that rendering lard – they didn’t think it was rendered enough. But I’m trying to think of the name in English of those – and there is a name for it, I heard the name so many times and I don’t remember it anyhow – but I know I ate it! Oh those were they days, and there was no refrigerator and you’d slaughter, well you’d slaughter pigs, 1034 you’d slaughter a cow, well, how were we gonna save the meat? the hams, the bacon, and the sausages were smoked. Well, they would keep. But the rest of the meat – well – there was a barrel, just like the sauerkraut barrels. And some of them were – Machella’s had a tremendouse one, because they had boarders and they really had a big barrel. I don’t know how many gallons went into that barrel. Well, you would wash up all the meat after it was all cut up after it was slaughtered. You’d wash up that meat, you’d put a layer of meat in the bottom, you’d add salt to it, pour a good bit of salt into it. Then you’d add another layer of meat on top, put a layer of salt. And you would do that until you would use up all of your meat. And then you’d make a salty brine, and put it in. And the meat would keep. Then when you needed meat, you would go and you would take meat out of the barrel and put it into water and let it soak to get that brine out of it. Let it soak. And then you would use it for whatever you wanted it. If it was pork and you wanted to do a pork, you would do it, and if you wanted, if it was beef and you wanted to make soup, you would take the piece out that you wanted for soup, and you would cook soup out of it.

AV: Who did that, who put up this pork?

HF: Well, the man helped, and the woman, the lady of the house helped. They would 10[?]7 work together and get that done.

AV: Where would they put the barrel?

HF: Of all places, the parlor!

AV: Why the parlor?

HF: That was the coldest place in the house! YOu wouldn’t take it down the cellar because the cellar was damp. But you would put it in the parlor. And of course you didn’t entertain boyfriends in the parlor! There weren’t any parlor suites! I remember Machella’s parlor, there was a barrel of meat standing there. I was a kid, I don’t know, about nine or so, or eight, and I wasn’t allowed to do the cleaning at home, because naturally I didn’t know how to do it. My sister Mary would do it and I didn’t have to interfere. Well, if I would go over to Machella’s I could do whatever I wanted to do. My line of cleaning was, you know, whatever came across as you were sweeping, whatever you came across, it went ahead of the broom. You didn’t pick it up, it went ahead of the broom. And if it was upstairs, everything was swept downstairs! If somebody would do that for me today, I’d knock their head off! But Mrs. Machella never interefered with me. I could do whatever I wanted to 1090 do. It was fine. So they had, you didn’t buy cookies by the pound, you bought them by, it was a wooden box, oh I should say it was this big – long – wide – and there was a lid on it, it used to open on hinges. and you had so many different kind of cookies in this box.

AV: Where did you buy it from?

HF: From the grocer. Because you didn’t buy it by the pound, how long would a pound last! They weren’t cakes, you know layer cakes and all that…… you put a bowl of cookies out on the table.… so you’d go to this box of cookies you know, and pick out what you liked. there were cookies with the

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A Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -18- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

1115 peanuts, the halves of peanuts were stuck on the top of them, they were the peanut cookies. We used to look for that. Molasses cookies were always left until the end. There were ginger cookies in there, there were, any kind of cookie you wanted was in there, a whole assortment. And there were a couple layers in the box, not one layer, because the box was, I guess, about this high.

AV: About twenty inches high?

HF: Oh, I don’t know about how high that would be. But anyway, they would stand in the parlor too.

AV: How much was that box?

HF: Oh, I have no idea. Prices didn’t interest me then. You know, I didn’t that to pay for them! But……

AV: Would a lot of peope buy their cookies instead of make them?

HF: Well, a lot of them didn’t know how to bake those things at that time. And then, they wouldn’t have the time, because they’d bake bread. That was one thing they did bake, they baked bread, and they baked it in those outside ovens.

AV: And your mother used that?

HF: My mother didn’t have an outside oven, not in our yard, almost everyone did. She baked in the stove. But Mrs Machella had a big outside oven. And whenever she baked bread, it wasn’t two or three loaves. Because of all those 1146[?] boarders. Two or three loaves you could slice that up for two meals.

AV: What did it look like, her oven?

HF: Oh, I couldn’t even describe it. I was tellin’ you once before how that oven was made. The men The men used to make it themselves. There were bricks in it, there was.… they’d have this clay that they woud have between the bricks, and the fire, I don’t know whether the fire was underneath or was it in the back of the oven. You know, in the back of it, where you put your bread on, I should think it would be heavy sheets of iron that were on the bottom, and then you put your pans of bread on there.

AV: How large was that surface?

HF: Oh, that was, you could get quite a few pans of bread on that.

AV: Was it square or round?

HF: Well, the inside of it was more on the wide side than the long side. And then the top of it was made, well, they had like a roof and all made over the top of that. But the oven itself was made of brick clay, because they didn’t go using cement at that time. And then there was a heavy iron door, well, it was a sheet of iron, that you put up agains the oven to keep it closed whenever the bread was bakin’. And then you would take, there was like a handle on it that you could take it down. And there was a long, like a hoe, it was made like a hoe, and you could reach in to get your pans of bread with that.

AV: What did you call it?

HF: I wouldn’t have any idea what they called it, it was made for a purpose, to pull, if your pans of bread were way back, well you couldn’t reach in there, you had to pull them out with this, like a big scraper. And to put the bread in there, they had like an iron paddle, like. There was a long handle on it, and you would put your pan of bread on there and you would reach way back in and put it back into your oven, because you couldn’t reach that far with your arm to get the bread in. And when they’d bring the bread out of that oven 1211 boy, the loaves were really big. they were good.

AV: So the lady of the house had to do all that.

HF: Um-hmm, that was her job.

AV: How may oaves did she bake a week?

HF: I wouldn’t have any idea. But they baked a couple time a week, especially

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A. Varesano interviewing Helen Fedorsha -19- 6/15/72 Tape 14-1

1210 if they had boarders. You couldn’t go out and buy bread, like you can now. You run out of your own bread, you can just go out and buy whatever you want. You couldn’t do that. So, almost everything was done at home, and even noodles, today you buy them, at that time you couldn’t buy them, you had to make them.

AV: Were they made often in the house?

HF: Any time that they had soup or anything that they would use noddles for It’s 1218 no problem, it’s no job. Even the rolling out isn’t bad. I used to think it was at one time, when I had to do it, whether I liked it or not, I had to do it! But since I have to do it for myself.….I don’t do it too often, because you, on noodles, you have to use pressure, because your dough has to be good and hard. If you leave your dough soft, then your noodles are mushy. So you have your dough good and hard, well then you have to use pressure on that rolling pin, you know, to get it rolled out. And since I have trouble with this left hand, if I use pressure on it, then my hand itches me too much, and really makes me miserable. But like the dough for pridohe [?], I don’t have 1248[?] go have it that hard. It has to be on the softer side, or if it wouldn’t, then you couldn’t stick them together. You know whenever you fill them, and you have to stick them together, you wouldn’t be able to. And so they used to do all that themselves, and they they used to make what we called halushki, they were made from a noddle dough, but not, the dough wasn’t as hard as the noodle dough, anyway, because then your halushki wasn’t as.….they didn’t taste so good, because they would be too, too hard. It was all right the noodles, because the noodles you ate with soup. But the other things you ate with stewed cabbage, or some ate them with sour milk, some at them with cottage cheese – you had your own cottage cheese – and you would crumble up this cottage cheese, you’d boil your halushkis just like you did noodles, and you’d have your cottage cheese crumbled. After you’d have your halushkis drained, you’d crumble this cottage cheese over them and pour some browned 1274 butter over them, and that’s how you ate them.

AV: Did they make them for people when they had boarders?

HF: Oh, yes. A dish like that went a long way. But they didn’t make, you know, a little bowl like this.

AV: They didn’t, eh!

HF: They had a big pan! It was hard work, it was really had work. That’s why 128[?] those women kept so slim. I didn’t remember any fat women in those days. They were all good and slim. Because they got the exercise, all right, And if there were children in the house, well, there was a lot of work there, too, because they had to be fed, and she didn’t fuss around too much, like down at our Anna’s now, when the kids are comin’ home for lunch, this one likes tomato soup, well, they’re gonna open a can of tomato soup, that one likes something else, well that one, they’ll cook something else for that one. Everyone has something different. In those days, they would butter you a piece of bread and jelly, and give you a cup of coffee and keep your mouth shut! And if you managed to get, if the mother was able to spare a little bit of time, and she would make some potato cakes, well then that was really something. that was a special dinner!

AV: Good!…… You want a cup of coffee now?

HF: Ha ha! I think you’re gonna have a cup of coffee! 1315

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A. Varen. inter. H. Fed. -24- 8/23/72 Tape 29-1

to put the bread, she had big like a flat shovel with a long handle on it she used to put her pan of bread on there and she would shove it back so that’s as much as I can remember of it although they did have a cover over it it was like an open barn like a roof was made over it from that bake oven the fire that they put these use to go in to the smokehouse when ever they wanted to smoke meats they would put wood into that bake oven and it would go into the smokehouse and smoke the meats

AV: By a pipe or an underground passage

HF: no there must have been a pipe that went through because it wasn’t that low that it could go into an underground passage

AV: And this whole structure was maybe 8 ft. tall

HF: Oh I don’t know

AV: This barn like thing on top did it have a pointed roof

HF: Yeh, just like a barn

AV: And four posts supporting the roof

HF: Uh huh

AV: Tar paper roof I suppose

HF: I don’t know if it was a tar paper roof because in those days not many people used tar paper, things were done differently how they were done I don’t know, I don’t know if it was just plain boards or what they did have on because a lot of places they had corrugated sheet iron even on some homes they had corrugated sheet iron

AV: Why was that because it was easiy available

HF: I don’t know why they did have them

AV: Back street only

HF: I don’t know because I never got over to the Main Street that much, do you know when we were kids we didn’t go wonderin’ around like the kids do today we stuck to our own neighborhood there was kids in the whole town but the kids out of each

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A. Varen. inter. H. Fed. -25- 8/23/72 Tape 29-1

neighborhood would sort of stick together and we didn’t go wonderin’ around so I couldn’t really say, I got to the Main Street went I finally went to school up until then we didn’t do it and we had to be home at a certain time

AV: This structure there was a square made of bricks then rounded top, the back oven itself

HF: Well really Angela I couldn’t say exactly, from what I can remember or picture it was made like a mound round this way like an igloo, like a Mexican igloo

AV: And it was located would you say about 10 feet back of the shanty

HF: Oh probably more than ten feet, more than 10 feet back of the shanty

AV: Just to get someplace to get the proper place for them was

HF: Well some of them had them built right out on the garden, anywhere at all away from the house because you had to be careful of fires they watched very carefully in those days, you weren’t allowed to have anything around that would be flammable, even in the outside shanty’s they were called the summer kitchen well they were used in the summertime but they weren’t used in the wintertime you couldn’t it was too cold but everyone had the cows, pigs, geese, chickens, well you had your stable naturally where you could store your feed in there but you didn’t have where to put all that feed or even hay for the cow if you thought you could put it in the shanty, now you could stand on your head and nobody would say anything but once a month one of the foremen came around, I forget what his name way, I heard his name a million times, came around and he had the right, you couldn’t stop him from goin’ in, you couldn’t say like today, why I’m payin’ rent and you daren’t go in there, that was their property and he had the right to go in and look and if you had a lot of thrash in the shanty like I have now, I have a lot of trash that shouldn’t be there, and if you had hay or feed or anything that could catch fire even tho there was no stove there you were told about it

AV: This was when you were small

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– A. Varen. inter. H. Fed. – 26 – 8/23/72 Tape

HF: I don’t remember this bein’ done but I remember but I did hear my Dad talk about it and he said how they took care of these homes you were not allowed to drive a nail anywhere in their property without permission and if you were caught doin’ it you were warned and if you were caught doin’ it again you were suspended from work and if you did it again you were fired, there was a man by the name of Mr. Greegor my dad boarded in his place and he was a very good blacksmith and he was livin’ a house about where Mrs. Timko lives well already in my time there was a road that went, the office was in the back of where we lived, I’ll try and show you where the office was, there was a road that went right from the breaker it came down across the tracks and up around the office and up about the field out to Buck[?] Mountain and the boss made his trip at regular times it was no – it’s rainin’ or somethin’ of that sort – it had to be done, and Mr. Greegor was a blacksmith and to get to work it was easier for him to walk up the garden and go out the back way and right up that road, the road was right above his place up that road, up to the breaker to the blacksmith shop but he had to go out around there was no gate and he wasn’t allowed to build it, he wasn’t allowed to make a gate but being a good blacksmith he made hinge and without anybody seein’ him he cut the fence and he put the gate in there and my dad said you would never know by lookin’ at it that there was a gate there that’s how well he had it done now whether the boss saw him come out there one one day or how it happened but he was told about it and he was fired, fired from his job so that’s how thing were in those days around here, in later years Mr. Coxe didn’t care about what happened to the homes Mrs. Coxe was gone. Anybody that felt they don’t have enough room well they start tearin’ down buildin’ and and you look at this place here and you’ll see that as far as a board would come that’s where it ended there’s no tryin’ to make it even or make it look presentable or anything under there until I got the carpet in the kitchen there

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A. Varen. inter. H. Fedor. – 27 – 8/23/72 Tae 29-1

was a big opening under that doorframe that’s all the futher that came take it down and it was tacked on like that they took out doors that opened up the place well everyone wassn’t in the same position and when they would leave and someone wanted to get that house well maybe you couldn’t do what they did and you were in a spot they weakened homes they small homes like where Mrs. Timko’s livin’ there were homes up that end, every hoe was that size there were families up there that wanted to enlarge their upstairs there was only one bedroom they wanted to enlarge their upstairs they took out a good part of the support as tho they would take this wall out and well that weakens your floor up there they did that and of course there was no floor about there. Well the roof sank down like that

AV: Well let me ask this, you remember the Sennick back oven, whereabout was it in the yard do you know

HF: It was in the garden down a good distance down in the garden and

AV: And vegetables planted all around it

HF: I don’t know if they planted, almost everyone planted but as you walk down the garden you could walk right over to the bake oven it wasn’t by the house

AV: It was reached by a board walk or something

HF: No, dirt walk

AV: And then the other one you mentioned having a back oven where was that

HF: I don’t know if it was a bake oven or an outside cellar there’s still a mound of dirt up here but the opening and everything is covered well whether it was a bake oven or an outside cellar like Mrs. Timko has see I don’t know

AV: Who was that family again

HF: A Sherman family and I don’t know who lived in there before them oh there were others that lived there, the Goonies and then [?????????] lived in there and I don’t know who else

AV: When the Sherman place burned down

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A. Varen. inter. H. Fed. – 28 – 8/23/72 Tape 29-1

HF: No it was torn down and this Fific home up here was burned down

AV: This Sherman place this mound whatever it was was it located right in back of the shanty

HF: You can see it out there you can it it out in the garden in the Fall of the year we take a walk up there me and Joseph took a walk up there but there isn’t any opening it’s just a big mound of dirt now

AV: And the house is not there anymore so you can’t tell

HF: Oh no

AV: At what part of the house it was located, do you remember, was it right outside of the shanty

HF: It was down furthere, down in the garden you can figure it out by Petroskie’s shanty. That Petroskie’s house part of it is still standing because the shanty’s were on a line and this is a little further down and the shanty was there and this is on this side of the road of the garden not on that side where the shanty is

AV: To one side of it

AV: People used to have to build their outside cellars by themselves tho

HF: From stones and clay and it was really marvelous the things that they know to do without any education

AV: Well but that’s why everybody didn’t have outside cellars because it took a long time to make them

HF: Oh they’d help one another in those days people helped one another not like today

AV: So many people had the outside cellars

HF: There were a lot of them because if you had any potatoes or things like that where were you going to sotre it in those small houses like where Mrs. Timko is living there was a trap door on the floor in some of the houses the trap door see there was only 2 rooms down stairs, the kitchen and what you considered

page_0124

A. Varen. inter. H. Fed. – 29 – 8/23/72 Tape 29-1

the living room most everywere it was a bedroom and the trap door would be in that room and I know in that small housse that we lived in right up across the alley here well that trap door was directly under our bed we had a bed down in the front room because upstairs there were 2 beds my brothers and our Annie and our Mary downstairs I was the youngest of the family I wasn’t even 6 years old when we moved from there well I slept with my mother and dad and their bed was down in the front room and under the bed if you wanted to go down in that cellar you had to move the bed to get to that trap door it was a regular square trap door, for potatoes or whatever you could put down there well they didn’t go in so much for canned goods because they didn’t know how to do it

AV: So you didn’t have a cold cellar in your place

HF: Not one of those outside no

AV: Do you rememberr who else on Back Sreet had cold cellars

HF: I don’t remember

end 970

Contributions Message

judyak, Ann Kline, Janis Sheppard, Marisa Bozarth, Melanie Akren-Dickson, Stephen Talacka, Helen Grebski, birdbox and Camille Westmont